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Thread: Darksides

  1. #11
    Senior Member duk2n's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by turbodieseli4i6 View Post
    The Michelins have a harder compound in the center and a softer compound on the edges
    The OEM Metzelers have the same compound distribuition. I'm reaching the 8,000 miles with them and I think I will not change them yet (the plan was to have the dealer changing them while the 8,000 miles service)
    -JL-

    Mao a mucha honra

  2. #12
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    More info from a magazine on the merits, relative safety and basic engineering of CT on a MC:

    Tales From the Dark Side: Putting Car Tires on Motorcycles | Rider Magazine



    This topic comes up often on big touring/sport touring and cruiser bike threads and quickly turns into some what of an oil thread

    Edit: not a fan of this CT thing
    Last edited by showkey; 20th February 2013 at 07:54.

  3. #13
    Senior Member treybrad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by showkey View Post
    This topic comes up often on big touring/sport touring and cruiser bike threads and quickly turns into some what of an oil thread
    Right, it usually comes up on discussions involving big tourers/sport tourers that chew through their rubber quickly -- Goldwings, Valkyries, Triumph Rocket III, etc. I was getting 12-14k miles out of rear tires (Michelin PR2) on my Bandit 1250, which had a reputation for eating rubber.

    I expect to get at least 15k miles out of a PR2/3 on the little NC. And with options like the Commander 2 that supposedly last 25k miles on HD tourers, you could probably get 30k out of it.

    IMO, the risk/benefit just isn't worth it. Sure, maybe you could get 50k out of a CT, but if you can get 30k out of a proper MT that will allow you to enjoy the bike fully, why bother?

    Figure $150 for either option, the $/mi for the CT is $.003, and for the MT is $.005. If you're pinching pennies that tightly, you're in the wrong hobby altogether.

    How many miles are you really putting on the bike per year anyway?

    trey

  4. #14
    Junior Member Ishkatan's Avatar
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    My brother in law has a darkside on his Goldwing and I watched it carefully. When he leans the bike quite a bit about 1/3 of the tread will lift but there is still more rubber on the road than if he had a regular motorcycle tire. The sidewalls flex. The true test will be what he does when it is time to replace the tire.

    For a lighter motorcycle like the NC700x the Michelines with the hard center seem extremely practical. The only question is does that increase breaking distance, especially on wet pavement?

  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ishkatan View Post
    ...For a lighter motorcycle like the NC700x the Michelines with the hard center seem extremely practical. The only question is does that increase breaking distance, especially on wet pavement?
    I had some serious misgivings on a similar tire, the Michelin Pilot Power Pure. Last winter I was riding in marginal conditions on one of my commutes. On the freeway, all was fine. I exited on an elevated off-ramp with an S-curve. I looked ahead and the entire surface of the off-ramp was covered in white hoar frost. I slowed as much as possible, and slid just a bit on each of the two portions of the S-curve. That was with Pirelli tires and one consistent tread compound over the tire.

    Now if the center tread is designed to last longer...how good is the traction? As I'm not an engineer I'm only guessing, but my thinking is it would seem like it would be harder and offer less traction. The softer side tread would be more like the Pirelli. That combination would be fine in normal dry conditions. However...

    So if I slid on a tire that has an excellent reputation for traction in both dry and wet conditions...how badly would I have slipped if the dual-compound Michelin was on the bike? Sure the side tread has more grip, but in this case, I don't want to be leaning over that far to explore how well that grip is. By the time I'm leaned over enough for the softer grippier tread to be in contact, I've lost control of the bike.

    Just food for thought... Many people don't ride in temps below 40F, so for them it is a moot point and the tire offers an excellent way to get a decent tire that will last quite a few miles. But if you're a commuter who rides in temps down around 35F, it is worth thinking about.

    Chris

  6. #16
    Senior Member draco_1967's Avatar
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    I had a set of PR3s on my last bike (03 nighthawk 750) that is very similar in weight and handling to the NC. I felt very secure on wet roads. I rode in a snow storm and the only time I felt the tires slip was after slush accumulated on the road.

    Slush, frost, sand, oil, etc will make any tire insecure.

  7. #17
    MZ5
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    Supposedly, the way the multi-compound Michelins work is _not_ that the center compound is 'harder' than what you'd expect of a tire of the type, rather the shoulders/sides have a _softer_ compound than 'normal' for a tire of the type. That's what I've read in a couple places, anyway. If true, then there'd be no issue with unexpectedly lowtraction in adverse conditions.

  8. #18
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    I can accept that MZ5, but then I wonder how they get higher mileage from the tire? Generally, it is the center tread that wears out first. If it is the same as other single compound tires, then I'd think it would wear just as fast.

    Just puzzled. I'd love for that to be true.

    Chris

  9. #19
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    Back on the darkside idea, I ran a car tire on the back of my VTX for four years, put around twenty thousand miles on it and still had years of tread left.
    At full lean I still had more tire on the road than I did with my motorcycle tires. What people don't realize when they talk about car tires is that the compounds used on the average car tire is softer than what is used on motorcycle tires, which means more traction, and there is always more tire on the road, sometimes twice as much as a motorcycle tire which also translates into more traction. There are plenty of video's of riders on the dragon with car tires and you watch them from the camera on the next bike. The bike leans, the side wall on the tire will flex allowing half of the bottom of the tire to maintain on the pavement, you can see that on the video's.
    I got caught in the rain one night, which I actively try to avoid, and decided to see what kind of traction I had on a wet road. I stopped on a side street and launched the bike to see what it would take to spin the tire, when the front tire came back down to the pavement, I decided NOT to try that experiment again!
    The last thing I will say is on the subject of "having to get used to it". Every bike will feel differently with a new set of tires and you will "have to get used to it". No different with a car tire. It requires more input to turn BUT takes the same amount of input to turn every time, just like a motorcycle tire. Once you have ridden for twenty miles you forget that its different and it becomes normal just like riding any other tire will.

    To each his own, but don't be put off by those who talk like they know and have never tried it.

  10. #20
    Senior Member frozenpoet's Avatar
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    To each their own, but I'm not worried about tread life. I also feel that there is more engineering mumbo jumbo that goes into the design of a tire than what we, or at least I, know. So if it doesn't say that is meant for a motorcycle, it's not going on my bike. Just my two pennies.
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