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Considering Upgrading from Honda CBR300R

Forty Two

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Up to now I have been riding a Honda CBR300R. A good bike to learn on. In my non-bike life, I drive an automatic transmission car. The 750x DCT has caught my eye. I am 5'10" and the height and balance of the bike seems comfortable to sit on. I am not a fan of constantly changing gears and would rather use that energy to pay attention to the road and enjoy my surroundings.

I am wondering what are some of the idiosyncrasies or general thoughts of the DCT that other riders have found? I do not know of any other DCT riders in person and non-DCT riders have been generally negative about the idea of the DCT: You will be bored. What will you do if the bike shifts while in a corner? You will have less control over the bike in general. You will have less control going down hills. You will wear down your brakes faster. Something else that can break on the bike.

Can you please provide your thoughts?

Thank you
 
Welcome to the forum, Forty Two!

Good questions. I’d like to hear the thoughts of NCX DCT owners, too. I have a co-volunteer who brought two KTMs with him, and more at home, who shows disdain for the Honda and DCT in particular. “It needs a dealer to do an expensive service on it at 40k miles”; “lf you don’t put it in neutral at every stop it’ll wear out the clutches quickly”; “Not just two oil filters, but a second oil sump for the DCT”; “Already old technology, racers have moved on to much better systems now”; and on and on. :rolleyes: I get the impression that he, and many like him, don’t like the New Concept. Good thing I don’t care what others think.
 
I have about 25000 miles on my 2014 DCT. At first, I wasn't sure about the bike, but now, I love it. I've done long trips, but most of my riding is to go out and do a 100 or 200 miles around home. If you want to shift, hit the paddles, if not, let it take care of itself. The bike has been flawless.

20160612_080529-L.jpg
 
1910-Cars will never be as reliable as a good old horse and buggy.
1950- Automatic transmissions will never beat a good old manual.
Ha! None of what they said is true. None!
Go with the DCT. It's great. You'll love it.

Sent from my VS995 using Tapatalk
 
I am wondering what are some of the idiosyncrasies or general thoughts of the DCT that other riders have found? I do not know of any other DCT riders in person and non-DCT riders have been generally negative about the idea of the DCT: You will be bored. What will you do if the bike shifts while in a corner? You will have less control over the bike in general. You will have less control going down hills. You will wear down your brakes faster. Something else that can break on the bike.

If you need a manual transmission to keep from getting bored on a bike find something else to do. Shifts in a turn are not a problem with traction. You will have more control if you don't have to worry about being in the right gear during emergency maneuvers. You can always select Manual control if you want. The shift points are smart, downshifting when you need it for power or for engine braking. Engine braking actually reduces brake wear. DCT is another system that can break but it's pretty reliable. There are many high mileage bikes with no issues.

Sent from my VS995 using Tapatalk
 
With multiple Automatic modes and a Manual (trigger/paddle) mode to choose from you won’t get bored. The DCT can and will do anything you want or need it to do from rabbit starts at the stop light to leisurely effortless cruising to mountains and switchbacks to walking speed in the parking lots to blasting through the curves and turns. It’s always in the right gear. It won’t stall out on you because you miss-judged a turn and didn’t downshift in time. It won’t lose an ounce of speed on the upshifts in either auto or manual mode.... and on and on. In fact, i would go so far as to say that the DCT will challenge you to learn how to fully utilize and maximize the modes like no traditional clutched bike ever will. And once you do, you’ll have a load of fun with it.

After decades of motorcycling I thought I’d miss the whole squeeze and kick routine. NOPE. I decided to give the latest (for bikes anyway) technology a shot and I have no regrets.

As for maintenance, the DCT adds one additional small filter to be changed at every other oil change interval. And it’s as easy as one two three. No dealer required!
And the part about neutral at stop lights is baloney. DCT is going into some of the most rugged adventure bikes and expensive touring bikes. I’ll certainly never “break it”..
 
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Thank you for your input everyone. Please keep them coming.

My biking will be probably 50% in town. Picking up milk from the grocery store, visiting friends, and running other errands where powering up my 6 cylinder minivan seem just silly from the gas-consumption point of view. There is a stop sign or a light every 5 feet and I am constantly shifting. On weekends and evenings it will be rides in the country but even there, I would like to enjoy the ride more by not shifting and as was mentioned, not having to worry about being in the correct gear for emergency manoeuvres.

My favourite line from someone so far has been: If you do not want to shift gears than get a scooter!
 
I’m not a DCT owner and don’t want one, but you might be exactly the buyer that Honda intended for the DCT. If clutching and shifting isn’t something you love to do, and you won’t miss it, then the DCT is for you. Bored? No, there are plenty of modes and buttons to play with to keep you entertained. The transmission works very well. Shifts are smooth enough that shifts in a corner are hardly noticed.

The lack of control you will have is that you can’t use a clutch to smooth out transitions between off and on throttle, or in slow curves. For very low speed turns, you can’t slip the clutch for fine speed control; you will need to rely on careful throttle control and dragging the rear brake. If you’re a relatively new rider and don’t already depend on those techniques, then you won’t miss the clutch so much.

See if you can find a way to test ride a DCT motorcycle, then you’ll know if it’s right for you. I think you’ll find it to be an impressive machine, and fun to ride.

As for the comment you heard about scooters, there’s nothing wrong with them either. My wife and I have 3 in the garage. In fact, there’s a 250cc CVT scooter parked right next to an 1800cc Goldwing. Which one to ride depends on what we’re doing. Why some people put scooters in a separate, often undesirable class, I don’t know.
 
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I’m not a DCT owner and don’t want one...

The lack of control you will have is that you can’t use a clutch to smooth out transitions between off and on throttle, or in slow curves. For very low speed turns, you can’t slip the clutch for fine speed control; you will need to rely on careful throttle control and dragging the rear brake. If you’re a relatively new rider and don’t already depend on those techniques, then you won’t miss the clutch so much.
...

The one thing that I had to figure out with the DCT is since there is no clutch, and therefore no ability to use the 'friction zone' it took me some time to figure out that my foot pressing the brake pedal going into turns and also for low speed maneuvers provides greater control.

Basically I use rear brake against the throttle in much the same way that you use the clutch's friction zone against a throttle.

I don't find that I have any "lack of control" at all. It just takes a slightly different technique.

I'm loving the DCT. Honestly don't see any reason to buy a bike that doesn't have a DCT (or similar) system. It is amazing in traffic with stop & go traffic and works great everywhere else. I do override the DCT by using the button shifters for passing on highways, steep hills, etc but then the DCT takes over again automatically.
 
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I’d echo 670cc on scooters. They are a blast to ride. I’ve owned several big and small. Anyone who just knocks them out of hand has probably never tried one and doesn’t have a clue what they’re missing. Sounds to me like you need to expand your circle of riding buddies. Pretty narrow minded bunch if ya don’t mind my sayin’ so. If you take their comments too much to heart you’re going to miss a lot of good times on two wheels!

Variety is the spice of life!
 
Don't put it in neutral at a stop light; you may need to move quickly - just turn the throttle. Do put it in neutral for other stops to keep it from moving with an unexpected turn of the throttle (lesson from an embarrassing incident).

Sent from my VS995 using Tapatalk
 
I’d echo 670cc on scooters. They are a blast to ride. I’ve owned several big and small. Anyone who just knocks them out of hand has probably never tried one and doesn’t have a clue what they’re missing. Sounds to me like you need to expand your circle of riding buddies. Pretty narrow minded bunch if ya don’t mind my sayin’ so. If you take their comments too much to heart you’re going to miss a lot of good times on two wheels!

Variety is the spice of life!

Yes, people like to voice their opinions. Sometimes it is just easier to let them have their say and then get on with what I am doing.

I have seen several YouTube videos where people were skeptics of the DCT and then loved it.
 
I’m not a DCT owner and don’t want one, but you might be exactly the buyer that Honda intended for the DCT. If clutching and shifting isn’t something you love to do, and you won’t miss it, then the DCT is for you.

Exactly. I do not enjoy clutching and shifting. It seems to be a chore. I keep getting told I will learn to like it. I really do not think so. It was not my thing in a car, and I do not think it will be on a bike. To me it deters from the enjoyment of the ride.
 
The one thing that I had to figure out with the DCT is since there is no clutch, and therefore no ability to use the 'friction zone' it took me some time to figure out that my foot pressing the brake pedal going into turns and also for low speed maneuvers provides greater control.

Basically I use rear brake against the throttle in much the same way that you use the clutch's friction zone against a throttle.

I don't find that I have any "lack of control" at all. It just takes a slightly different technique.

I'm loving the DCT. Honestly don't see any reason to buy a bike that doesn't have a DCT (or similar) system. It is amazing in traffic with stop & go traffic and works great everywhere else. I do override the DCT by using the button shifters for passing on highways, steep hills, etc but then the DCT takes over again automatically.

You have a good point. Less control would have been a more accurate description than lack of control.
 
I have seen several YouTube videos where people were skeptics of the DCT and then loved it.

I've seen that happen to people in person.

Before I bought our first DCT equipped bike several of my rider friends told me that shifting was fun. I never thought so. We bought a used NC700x (with only 4 miles on it) for my wife and I quickly realized that I needed one too. A few months later I had an NC750x. I now ride constantly. I leave the hard luggage cases on the bike all the time because I can carry the groceries and an amazing amount of other goods in those boxes!



You have a good point. Less control would have been a more accurate description than lack of control.

I honestly don't consider it less. I consider it different. I could do figure 8s on a HD inside 4 parking spaces. I can do the same, easier, on a Honda with DCT. There is a learning curve to get really good with the DCT but it gives the same amount of control but it is controlled differently. Right hand needs to learn to work with right foot. With a clutch lever the right hand doesn't need to be controlled as tightly because the left hand can override the right by working the friction zone of the bike. Different, not less.
 
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Hardly a daily occurrence, but sometimes going down a forest road I’ll need to get past dried, deep mud ruts and/or washouts and to do so I “walk” the bike with both feet for balance while carefully managing power by slipping the clutch in first gear. I’m not seeing offhand what the alternative would be with DCT since I wouldn’t be able to use the rear brake.

If I was still commuting to work each day in traffic the DCT would absolutely be my choice. Now? I avoid cities and traffic like the plague. Last time I traveled from Reno to Yuma I added over 100 miles through Barstow, California in order to not go through Las Vegas. For my current situation and preferences, DCT vs manual does not have a clear verdict.

For the OP? Yeah, go for the DCT, Forty Two.
 
Dellaster, set the bike into 1st gear (switch the DCT to manual) and modulate speed with the throttle. I've not been in that exact circumstance. But I've been on slippery clay, etc. You need to learn to manage the throttle a bit more carefully with the DCT but it works :)
 
What he said ^^^ +1

It won’t upshift automatically while in manual mode. So you can creep it or wind it up as needed.
 
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What he said ^^^ +1

It won’t upshift automatically while in manual mode. So you can creep it or wind it up as needed.

What he said + another 1. With no clutch control, you will need to learn very fine throttle control. Fortunately, the NC700X/750X has excellent fueling and throttle “feel”.
 
I learned to ride on automatic clutch Hondas 50 years ago so my low speed technique was learned without a clutch. Riding a bike with a clutch came later and neither seems to offer me less control of the machine in finesse maneuvers. Combining and overlapping throttle and brake to tension the drive train are advanced techniques that any rider can learn.

As far as reliability goes DCT is out there in many thousands of 2 and 4 wheel Honda machines for 10 years and general reliability is not in question. Small point of comparison, my manual transmission Goldwing belongs to a generation of GWs with numerous transmission issues and no one would or does consider it a flawed motorcycle to the point of being dismissive.

No Honda DCT requires an expensive dealer service at 40,000 miles. No Honda motorcycle I know of requires this, DCT or manual. Two oil filters are required yes, the new one is $8 every 16,000 miles. Big deal. No DCT requires being in neutral to avoid wearing out the clutches. Experience in this forum is you are more likely to replace the clutch in a manual NC700X. You have complete control going down hills, you do not wear the brakes more quickly, it doesn't matter if the bike shifts in a corner because it shifts so quickly it does not upset the suspension. Or you choose different shift points, or manual mode, or override automatic shifts manually.

Uninformed or ignorant people thinking "automatic" default to the only automatic they know, probably a car. DCT is not a hydrostatic torque converter automatic like a car/truck has or a CVT like many scooters have. It's not their fault for the most part, folks just don't know any better. I can remember how misinformed people were when the VFR1200F came out then the NC700 variants came out two years later in 2011. If you were bothered by the comments of others you were in for a long rough patch. Then the VFR1200X came out followed by the Africa Twin a few years later. The reviews on these bikes were much better and the 2018 DCT Goldwing better yet. DCT went from lamestream to mainstream, selling in greater numbers DCT than manual on certain models. The basic technology isn't any different but the riding community isn't as ignorant as it was 10 years ago and each successive generation brought improvements. Honda has always given each DCT motorcycle a manual counterpart and fully expected it would take a while to become popular.

Something DCT offers is learning how to exploit the abilities it offers to riders ranging from rank novice to expert. If you like learning new riding skills the DCT can expand your world. Multiple auto modes, semi auto modes or full manual, you can slip back and forth between all of these on one twisty road in order to extract the exact level of performance you are able to achieve.
 
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