DCT in cold weather

[the Ferret]

I generally ride year round which means often riding when it's below freezing, and down into the teens. Does the DCT trans act any differently in cold weather as opposed to warm weather? Sluggish shifting or anything?

 

[bigbird]

I've found that when the engine oil is cold (around freezing) the trans shifts more noisily and not nearly as smoothly as when the engine has warmed up.
The trans tends to slip the clutches when cold, leading to a slight lunging when 2 and 3rd gear engage.
This only happens for about 2 minutes of riding from the cold start.
It's not a biggy by any means.
BTW, I'm using the suggested GN4 10W-30.

 

[the Ferret]

I've found that when the engine oil is cold (around freezing) the trans shifts more noisily and not nearly as smoothly as when the engine has warmed up.
The trans tends to slip the clutches when cold, leading to a slight lunging when 2 and 3rd gear engage.
This only happens for about 2 minutes of riding from the cold start.
It's not a biggy by any means.
BTW, I'm using the suggested GN4 10W-30.

Have you tried a longer warm up? or is it the same regardless of warm up length?

 

[lowrider]

I've found that when the engine oil is cold (around freezing) the trans shifts more noisily and not nearly as smoothly as when the engine has warmed up.
The trans tends to slip the clutches when cold, leading to a slight lunging when 2 and 3rd gear engage.
This only happens for about 2 minutes of riding from the cold start.
It's not a biggy by any means.
BTW, I'm using the suggested GN4 10W-30.

Is that a full synthetic oil?

 

[670cc]

Is that a full synthetic oil?

Honda GN4 is recommended for the NC series engine. It is not a full synthetic oil.

 

[bigbird]

Have you tried a longer warm up? or is it the same regardless of warm up length?

I have, and if I let it idle for 5 minutes before riding away, it is smooth.
But I normally wouldn't let my engine sit idling for 5 minutes to get the oil warmer.
Usual cold start idling for me is 1 minute, while I reset my odometer, then get my helmet and gloves on.
Waste of gasoline IMHO.
I just drive it easy for the first few minutes, like any other internal combustion engine.

 

[bigbird]

Is that a full synthetic oil?

Full mineral oil, not even semi-synthetic.

 

[dduelin]

I never noticed the DCT acting any different in cold weather with starts as low as the high 20sF. I used the recommended 10w30 dino most of the time in my DCT. Once or twice I may have used the Honda 10w30 synthetic but about 30,000 miles using GN4 Honda oil. Start it and ride it off.

 

[lowrider]

Honda GN4 is recommended for the NC series engine. It is not a full synthetic oil.

Thank you Sir! Always best to follow Mother Honda's advise.
I switched to full syn in my Bandit 1250 and it is much smoother shifting and really has no warm up period that I can notice. It's a half mile to the main road and the engine is up to temp and ready to go when I get there.

 

[hulkss]

Honda GN4 is recommended for the NC series engine. It is not a full synthetic oil.

Not to make this an oil thread, here is what Honda says about their synthetic oil:

"New Pro Honda HP4S is Honda’s first fully synthetic four-stroke motorcycle oil and was quite literally years in the making. HP4S offers lower friction than conventional oils, better oxidation resistance for better high-heat performance, higher film strength and quicker flow to vital engine parts at low temperatures, especially during startup. And best of all, HP4S provides maximum power due to less frictional drag. HP4S is approved for use in all 2006 or newer motorcycles, ATVs, Scooters and PWC. It is, quite simply, our very finest four-stroke oil. HP4S is compatible with synthetic blends such as HP4, as well as regular petroleum oils like GN4. There is no need to flush the crankcases before switching to HP4S."

My engine and DCT works great at all temperatures with HP4S.

 

[670cc]

Not to make this an oil thread, here is what Honda says about their synthetic oil:

"New Pro Honda HP4S is Honda’s first fully synthetic four-stroke motorcycle oil and was quite literally years in the making. HP4S offers lower friction than conventional oils, better oxidation resistance for better high-heat performance, higher film strength and quicker flow to vital engine parts at low temperatures, especially during startup. And best of all, HP4S provides maximum power due to less frictional drag. HP4S is approved for use in all 2006 or newer motorcycles, ATVs, Scooters and PWC. It is, quite simply, our very finest four-stroke oil. HP4S is compatible with synthetic blends such as HP4, as well as regular petroleum oils like GN4. There is no need to flush the crankcases before switching to HP4S."

My engine and DCT works great at all temperatures with HP4S.

The recommended oil is clearly described in the Honda owner’s manual. There is probably no need to discuss it beyond that. In their own motorcycle, people are free to use whatever type or brand oil they prefer, for whatever the reason.

 

[lowrider]

Nice to know info!!

 

[Deleted member 1183]

I use a non Honda semi synthetic 10/40. My experience in cold weather is a very slight abruptness in the lower gear changes on start off and that disappears after a couple of minutes like Big Bird says. It is never sluggish.

 

[lowrider]

I use a non Honda semi synthetic 10/40. My experience in cold weather is a very slight abruptness in the lower gear changes on start off and that disappears after a couple of minutes like Big Bird says. It is never sluggish.

Maybe the 2021's will allow/recommend the new Honda Synthetic....they spent that research time, effort and money for some reason. It seems a lot of new bikes are using synthetic for the reasons mentioned in the Honda release.

 

[dduelin]

Honda doesn't recommend their synthetic product OVER dino in any street motorcycle since 2007 IIRC. They offer HP4S synthetic product because oil marketers have been very successful in differentiating synthetic products and upselling them to buyers and Honda would needlessly ignore a lucrative market by not branding their own synthetic. If the machine is maintained to Honda service recommendations a dino product will easily ensure a long service life. Honda bets their remarkable reputation on it and it's been proven a good bet.

There are 3 recommendations for engine oil in Honda owners and service manuals. API certification, viscosity, and compatibility with oil bath "wet" clutches. Meet those 3 with a dino or synthetic oil and you have nothing to worry about.

 

[670cc]

Honda doesn't recommend their synthetic product OVER dino in any street motorcycle since 2007 IIRC. They offer HP4S synthetic product because oil marketers have been very successful in differentiating synthetic products and upselling them to buyers and Honda would needlessly ignore a lucrative market by not branding their own synthetic. If the machine is maintained to Honda service recommendations a dino product will easily ensure a long service life. Honda bets their remarkable reputation on it and it's been proven a good bet.

There are 3 recommendations for engine oil in Honda owners and service manuals. API certification, viscosity, and compatibility with oil bath "wet" clutches. Meet those 3 with a dino or synthetic oil and you have nothing to worry about.

Informative and very well said. Thanks for posting.

 

[mzflorida]

I've found that when the engine oil is cold (around freezing) the trans shifts more noisily and not nearly as smoothly as when the engine has warmed up.
The trans tends to slip the clutches when cold, leading to a slight lunging when 2 and 3rd gear engage.
This only happens for about 2 minutes of riding from the cold start.
It's not a biggy by any means.
BTW, I'm using the suggested GN4 10W-30.

Interesting. Never would have even guessed that would be the case.

 

[hulkss]

Interesting. Never would have even guessed that would be the case.

Oil viscosity affects the shifting performance of the DCT. Oil with more stable viscosity (less thick when cold, less thin when hot) will provide more consistent operation.

 

[the Ferret]

There are 3 recommendations for engine oil in Honda owners and service manuals. API certification, viscosity, and compatibility with oil bath "wet" clutches. Meet those 3 with a dino or synthetic oil and you have nothing to worry about.

Never heard it put more succinctly

 

[lowrider]

Never heard it put more succinctly

Succinct it was and if I offended someone I stand corrected.

I don't pretend to know or understand Honda's motivation for publishing their release but it clearly says their new product is "approved" for specified models.

"HP4S is approved for use in all 2006 or newer motorcycles, ATVs, Scooters and PWC. It is, quite simply, our very finest four-stroke oil. HP4S is compatible with synthetic blends such as HP4, as well as regular petroleum oils like GN4. There is no need to flush the crankcases before switching to HP4S."

All I said was Honda may recommend or allow it in the 2021 models and based upon the above they have "already done that" in their release. Will it appear in the owners or service manuals...we don't know yet but it sure smelled like a sales pitch to me...so my bet is the new 2021 owners and service manuals will address HP4S. But then I could be wrong.