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Front suspension upgrade!!

FYI, as per the pictures in the workshop manual, we already have progressive springs in the OEM setup. I have not dismounted the forks so I haven't seen them with my own eyes, but maybe someone here could confirm my findings...
 
I would be interested to find out, usually progressive springs allow for a soft almost floating first couple inches of travel and then firm up so that the big hits don't bottom the shock. That doesn't describe how my stock shocks work now. The stock forks feel to me like they have steady rate springs in them.
 
I have learnt that the NC700X/S forks are tuned for smooth tarmac. If any of you have ridden along bumpy roads with square edged bumps you should find you are getting sharp bumps thru the front forks. I have sent my forks to a very well regarded suspension tuner in Kiwi land. And have had both springs and race tech emulators installed.

In 2 weeks time I should also receive my matched Ohlins. In the mean while I will be doing around 3'000km touring around New Zealand. Will let you all know how it goes.!
 
Exactly, good progressive rate springs can get rid of most of the sharp stuff while still keeping you from bottoming out.

Good luck with the touring, New Zealand is an awesome place to travel. I go there before and after my Antarctica campaign the last two years and the views out in the country are amazing. For those who haven't been, if you've seen the lord of the rings or hobbit movies, you have seen some of New Zealand, they were shot there.
 
Exactly, good progressive rate springs can get rid of most of the sharp stuff while still keeping you from bottoming out.

FYI, the suspension tuner said the harsh bumps are from the limited oil flow of the damping forks. When a square edged bump comes thru spring compresses, but the oil is trapped and only gets to flow thru a very limited hole in the damping fork. By installing a race tech cartridge emulator, the oil valving can be tuned and will also be progressive.

Antarctica :) wow you have been?

Happy to post travel photos up on the forum of my NZ travels. :)
 
Interesting thread, zapf, post some pics please!

You can't see the internals. Forks looks the same outside :) but have a read of this EMULATORGV

and this http://racetech.com/page/id/129

It uses a stack of shims I believe that opens and closes depending on the speed of the oil flow / fork compression.

I have had the above done on my CBR1100XX where the forks are non adjustable, the differences are night and day.
 
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You can't see the internals. Forks looks the same outside :) but have a read of this EMULATORGV

and this Race Tech Sport Touring

It uses a stack of shims I believe that opens and closes depending on the speed of the oil flow / fork compression.

I have had the above done on my CBR1100XX where the forks are non adjustable, the differences are night and day.

I meant pics of New Zealand! I would love to come there someday.
 
The stock NC700X springs are progressive rate already. If you were unhappy with your spring rates (too soft or stiff), then you might benefit from different springs. The stock spring rates work well for me.

The stock forks use a simple, primitive damper rod system that can benefit from upgrade. I installed the Race Tech Gold Valve Emulators a few weeks ago on my NC700X. The initial test ride showed improvement when riding over sharp upward bumps. The emulators are adjustable, so I'll be taking notes and adjusting them if needed. So far they are working well. The tell tale sign it was improved was that I pretty much forgot about the forks after riding a few miles.

Installation of the Emulators involves removing the forks from the bike, and disassembly. The longest part of the job is drilling out the original damper holes in the damper rod. You also need to shorten the spring preload spacer to compensate for the addition of the emulator valves. I should have taken photos of the process but the directions included from Race Tech explain the procedure fairly well.

Greg
 
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Exactly, good progressive rate springs can get rid of most of the sharp stuff while still keeping you from bottoming out.

The main problem is the damper rod forks are tuned for overall damping rates but the simple damper rod design is incapable of reacting quickly to sharp, fast bumps. I don't think new springs will fix this. You will need to upgrade the damping system.

Greg
 
Ok, so the bike already has progressive rate springs, and I could add the race tech emulators which will allow the oil to flow more rapidly which should take away the harsh jolts in the early part of the fork travel when going over the rough stuff? Does anyone know what the weight of the fork oil is the bike comes with? I notice in the ad i linked to at the beginning, the new springs come with 10 weight oil which, if its lighter, should allow the oil to flow more rapidly than the heavier stock oil. I'm sure it won't flow like adding the race tech valves of course... Now better flow won't help if I'm bottoming the suspension, in fact seems like that would make it more likely for that to happen, right?
 
Ok, so the bike already has progressive rate springs, and I could add the race tech emulators which will allow the oil to flow more rapidly which should take away the harsh jolts in the early part of the fork travel when going over the rough stuff? Does anyone know what the weight of the fork oil is the bike comes with? I notice in the ad i linked to at the beginning, the new springs come with 10 weight oil which, if its lighter, should allow the oil to flow more rapidly than the heavier stock oil. I'm sure it won't flow like adding the race tech valves of course... Now better flow won't help if I'm bottoming the suspension, in fact seems like that would make it more likely for that to happen, right?

The stock oil that comes in the NC, and the oil recommended in the NC700X service manual, is 10 weight. I think if you just put lighter oil in the stock suspension, the forks could get springy and uncontrolled, like bad shocks on a car.

Once you put the GV emulators on, oil weight is used to control rebound damping, since the stock rebound holes are left alone. I left mine at 10 weight. The emulators are adjustable for compression damping via two different adjusters, one which primarily affects the response to square edge bumps, and the other which affects general compression damping.

Beemerphile sent his forks off to Race Tech and had them install both their springs and GV Emulators. He expressed pleasure with the results.

BTW, if you did want to buy Gold Valve Emulators, they are much cheaper elsewhere on the Web than direct from Race Tech.

Greg
 
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I had some time today to address the forks again. My forks were still a little stiff on sharp bumps, even with the Gold Valve Emulators. I loosened the GVE spring tension a bit, but it was still harsh. (The springs I'm talking about are the ones on the emulators). I'd watch the forks, and they might move less than an inch, rather than soak up the bump. If we've got over 5 inches travel up front, it'd be nice to use a little more of it.

So, last winter Matt from RaceTech suggested trying the silver 26 pound springs instead of the stiffer blue ones. I installed them today with two turns preload. I also drilled out all four holes on the valve plate. People that have installed this kit will know what I'm talking about.

When it quits raining I'll give it a whirl! No problem finding bumps around here.
 
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Let us know how you like 4 holes open. I did 3 which made a huge difference over stock but have been thinking about doing the 4th on my next fork maintenance. I also went with the light spring and around 3 turns. Big bumps are handle pretty good.
 
Let us know how you like 4 holes open. I did 3 which made a huge difference over stock but have been thinking about doing the 4th on my next fork maintenance. I also went with the light spring and around 3 turns. Big bumps are handle pretty good.

Thanks for your comments, bama.

The springs that originally came with my kit were the blue (40#) and the yellow (64#). The silver ones (26#) are lighter yet and were sent from RaceTech. The guideline pdf suggests going with three turns if you use the silver springs. I guess I'll see if two turns is too little. But I'm not worried; I'm slightly interested in swinging the pendulum to the side of soft, then I'll know what that's like and I find my center somewhere in between.

When I talked to Matt from RaceTech at the Chicago motorcycle show, he said they did a lot of testing and for some reason found that two holes drilled vs three didn't make a huge difference, but going to the fourth hole made a noticable change. So, I went from three to four to try it out. Matt sent me two more valve plates for free in case four holes is not to my liking, then I can go back to three holes.

Here's a link to the instructions for anyone interested: http://www.racetech.com/page/title/Emulator%20Tuning%20Guide
 
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