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My Other ride gets better mileage!

There will come a time when the earth has been stripped of all her oil, coal and gas. When that day comes you watch all the marvellous innovations that come to the fore. The ones that have been held back because of greedy bastards who think nothing of future generations, but only for their short term wealth.

I admit it: I am a tree hugger and bloody proud of the fact. People need to look at the bigger picture before it's too late, but they won't.

Off to hug some spruce :p

Bob
 
There will come a time when the earth has been stripped of all her oil, coal and gas. When that day comes you watch all the marvellous innovations that come to the fore. The ones that have been held back because of greedy bastards who think nothing of future generations, but only for their short term wealth.

I admit it: I am a tree hugger and bloody proud of the fact. People need to look at the bigger picture before it's too late, but they won't.

Off to hug some spruce :p

Bob

Of course the traditional fuels will rub out eventually, but there's greedy bastards in all industries especially the renewable sector. There's so much money to be made in subsidies that companies and landowners are falling over themselves in order to get to the front of the queue for some of the cash.
 
Of course oil is very important to the U.S. But may not be for the reason you think. Oil is traded in U.S. dollars. If that changes our dollar will be of no value. Our energy policies are a joke. We have the resources but refuse to produce.

I did not say I was against electric cars. I said if a large portion of the population went electric the grid can not handle it. I did say that I don't like my tax dollars paying to support alternative fuels. It prevents the advancements that would allow for tech that actually works. I hate subsidizing wind mills and then being forced to buy the electricity for more money.

you know your tax dollars are already going to support non "Alternative" fuels right? (also when did electricity become alternative? alternating current, doesn't make it alternative, we've been using the stuff for years...)

Cost of a gallon of gasoline with out subsidies would be something like $5-$15 a gallon (depending on which sides numbers you use)

Fun fact, globally we are putting about $1 trillion dollars into energy... estimated cost to end our dependance on oil 1.2 trillion... of course "alternative" energy is mostly capital investment (windmills don't cost much once they are up and running, solar panels will work for ~20 years after the initial investment) so that is probably 1.2 trillion mostly in capital expenses... it's cheaper to use alternative fuel right now, but oil gets a government break... and farming too, that's why we grow food for fuel (which per acre thanks to the incredible yields we get in the US we feed about the same number of people as they do in the third world, we also get fuel out of the ground at the same time... and manage to waste a lot of food too...)

Alternative is very nearly a good investment right now $200 billion dollars different, and it would solve global warming (for $200 billion dollars, or roughly the net worth of Chevron)
OF course:


The tech doubles every few years. In ten or twenty years we have no idea what advances the future will bring, but we spend billions of dollars on climate change with no measurable change. That money could be better spent. We did not sign the accords but are the only nation in the world that met them.

Of course if we spend nothing to fix climate change we'll be paying out for the damage climate change does... either way we are SOL...
Also, climate change is already costing us... look at insurance rates over the last 20-30 years to see the cost inching up... (we don't see it as a cost individually as consumers because insurance pays for the hail damage, flooding, etc. of course the insurance companies are increasing the rates to so the cost is hitting us gradually... that way we don't notice it as quickly.)

Hell, we elected and incompetent man as president twice (well really four times in a row). When people refuse to believe the truth they will believe anything. It's a touchy feely thing.

Wasn't there for all of them, but I'm guessing the number of presidential elections in this country where an idiot won was closer to ~50, though history is written by the winners, and we've only started the 24 hour news cycle of reporting on how big of an idiot every one is recently. Of course the presidency isn't supposed to actually be that big of a deal... but that is a completely different topic for a completely different lets all get pissy over politics thread.
 
Seeing money go over seas? Oh yeah, I drive a Toyota........but wait........it's a Tundra and built in Texas by Americans. Does that mean my money is going over seas or staying here in North America? I'm confused.

My Subaru was made in Indiana. My friends Chevy was made in South Korea...

My Subaru (and your Toyota) both contribute to this countries GDP... as for where the money goes... that gets complicated.

Some of it goes to the american workers who built our cars, some of it goes to their corporate overlords where ever they may be, then depending on the tax code that money might be re-invested in the US, or moved to a different country to subsidize operations there that aren't profitable (yet) some of it goes to the engineers, and testers who might be in the US, or might be in Japan, or any where else in the world...

Fun fact, thanks to the US tax code when Chevy builds a car over seas, and sells it over seas, very little of that money comes back to the US... repatriation tax I believe they call it, companies don't want to pay it so they leave the money over seas... it's how the US is basically paying to build out the rest of the worlds economy... perhaps with money we borrowed from China... which they don't even actually have to loan to us, they are borrowing against the future production of factories which are banking on the US continuing to buy crap...
 
Yes but i can't ride it in the winter. LoL only 3 months of riding here.

No way, eh. You should be able to ride from maybe April through October with some time in November depending on when the snow starts. At least that's what I used to do when I lived in T.O. and the GTA and vicinity.
 
Electric bill went up 30 bucks a month? That's 8.8 gallons of gas(almost 600 miles) where i live. All that time i would rather be on a motorcycle anyway. :)

No not a month. A full charge is between 1.20 and 1.50.
I don't always need to fully charge it.

What car gets 600 miles to 8.8 gallons.
My old hyundai accent got roughly 350 miles to 11 gallons (450-500kms from 45L)
I am assuming your trying to compare a car to a bike.


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Electric bill went up 30 bucks a month? That's 8.8 gallons of gas(almost 600 miles) where i live. All that time i would rather be on a motorcycle anyway. :)

No not a month. A full charge is between 1.20 and 1.50.
I don't always need to fully charge it.

What car gets 600 miles to 8.8 gallons.
My old hyundai accent got roughly 350 miles to 11 gallons (450-500kms from 45L)
I am assuming your trying to compare a car to a bike.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Oh ok. I thought you meant per month. And was talking about my NC getting almost 600 miles for 8.8 gallons. Am averaging about 68 miles per gallon. Last year my car got used for less than 300 miles for the whole year. I mostly just use it to go to the grocery store. I'm lucky enough to live where I can ride year round to work.
 
you know your tax dollars are already going to support non "Alternative" fuels right? (also when did electricity become alternative? alternating current, doesn't make it alternative, we've been using the stuff for years...)

Cost of a gallon of gasoline with out subsidies would be something like $5-$15 a gallon (depending on which sides numbers you use)

Fun fact, globally we are putting about $1 trillion dollars into energy... estimated cost to end our dependance on oil 1.2 trillion... of course "alternative" energy is mostly capital investment (windmills don't cost much once they are up and running, solar panels will work for ~20 years after the initial investment) so that is probably 1.2 trillion mostly in capital expenses... it's cheaper to use alternative fuel right now, but oil gets a government break... and farming too, that's why we grow food for fuel (which per acre thanks to the incredible yields we get in the US we feed about the same number of people as they do in the third world, we also get fuel out of the ground at the same time... and manage to waste a lot of food too...)

Alternative is very nearly a good investment right now $200 billion dollars different, and it would solve global warming (for $200 billion dollars, or roughly the net worth of Chevron)
OF course:




Of course if we spend nothing to fix climate change we'll be paying out for the damage climate change does... either way we are SOL...
Also, climate change is already costing us... look at insurance rates over the last 20-30 years to see the cost inching up... (we don't see it as a cost individually as consumers because insurance pays for the hail damage, flooding, etc. of course the insurance companies are increasing the rates to so the cost is hitting us gradually... that way we don't notice it as quickly.)



Wasn't there for all of them, but I'm guessing the number of presidential elections in this country where an idiot won was closer to ~50, though history is written by the winners, and we've only started the 24 hour news cycle of reporting on how big of an idiot every one is recently. Of course the presidency isn't supposed to actually be that big of a deal... but that is a completely different topic for a completely different lets all get pissy over politics thread.

With all due respect, you are mistaken on almost all of your points. What you present is greenie b.s. First off oil gets the same tax breaks as all big corporations do in this country. What you refer to is tax breaks. So called green energy gets our hard earned tax dollars and the tax breaks. Then their product is so expensive laws are passed to make us buy the product.

The cost of one nuclear power house would cost the same as the number of wind mills to produce the same power. But the power house would only be on a few acres. The life of the power house is greater and can produce power when the wind is not blowing.

I don't have a problem with any method of producing energy. But let each method stand on its own. There would be no alternative energy if laws and tax dollars were not involved. Tree huggers are good intentioned but they are a little to much like mushrooms.

When we are forcing ranchers to get rid of cattle because their farts are polluting the air it has gone to far. I am afraid they may figure out that when we exhale we are putting CO2 into the air. Funny thing is that in a controlled environment higher CO2 levels have a dramatic effect on increasing crop yield. Maybe we should stop playing God.
 
The Greens are mostly just mislead people looking for meaning in their lives, if you ask me.

That Iceland volcano that blew a few years ago wiped out ALL of mankinds pathetic attempts to control the gases in the atmosphere.
And there are always active volcanoes.

Enduring climate change is a part of being alive, so suck up your co2 rich air and enjoy life while you have it.
 
The Greens are mostly just mislead people looking for meaning in their lives, if you ask me.

That Iceland volcano that blew a few years ago wiped out ALL of mankinds pathetic attempts to control the gases in the atmosphere.
And there are always active volcanoes.

Enduring climate change is a part of being alive, so suck up your co2 rich air and enjoy life while you have it.

It's a business, a business like every other business; Except this business makes it politically incorrect and professionally destructive to disagree with it and they force you to buy their products whether or not you want them.

I'm all for environmental protection; But the #1 thing we should be protecting in the environment is human beings, everything else comes second.
 
Oh ok. I thought you meant per month. And was talking about my NC getting almost 600 miles for 8.8 gallons. Am averaging about 68 miles per gallon. Last year my car got used for less than 300 miles for the whole year. I mostly just use it to go to the grocery store. I'm lucky enough to live where I can ride year round to work.

I wish i could ride all year, or at least most of the year. Riding season is at best may to oct.


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I don't think wind mills are the answer. They do take up a lot of space and cost more per kilowatt hr( 11cent kilowatt hr). Here in Ontario the cheapest electricity is nuclear at 5.7cents a kilowatt/hr at OPG, which is publicly owned. Private nuclear, Bruce Power is up to 7.1 cents kilowatt hr. Solar is even crazier at up to 82 cents a kilowatt hr. Ouch!!
There are no more coal plants in Ontario. Just natural gas and bio. Plus hydro electric plants.


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I'm all for environmental protection; But the #1 thing we should be protecting in the environment is human beings, everything else comes second.

Can you expand on this for me?
Cheers,
Bob
 
With all due respect, you are mistaken on almost all of your points. What you present is greenie b.s. First off oil gets the same tax breaks as all big corporations do in this country. What you refer to is tax breaks. So called green energy gets our hard earned tax dollars and the tax breaks. Then their product is so expensive laws are passed to make us buy the product.

The cost of one nuclear power house would cost the same as the number of wind mills to produce the same power. But the power house would only be on a few acres. The life of the power house is greater and can produce power when the wind is not blowing.

I don't have a problem with any method of producing energy. But let each method stand on its own. There would be no alternative energy if laws and tax dollars were not involved. Tree huggers are good intentioned but they are a little to much like mushrooms.

When we are forcing ranchers to get rid of cattle because their farts are polluting the air it has gone to far. I am afraid they may figure out that when we exhale we are putting CO2 into the air. Funny thing is that in a controlled environment higher CO2 levels have a dramatic effect on increasing crop yield. Maybe we should stop playing God.

Yup... subsidies of any big corporation and then the subsidies that we give to mining companies... oh and the subsidies that we give to energy companies... oh and the tax breaks that were put in place by the robber barons all those years ago...

I'm all for nuclear power... at least when it is done right (we have a tenancy to generate a waste that we don't process, and just want to store some where.)

Problem with nuclear is the decommissioning is expensive, and you have to pre-pay to decommission the plant (to some extent) when you are first building it... capital expense on nuclear is actually alot more than what it is for solar and wind because of this... Unregulated nuclear would easily win out in the markets... but good god can you imagine the mess unregulated nuclear could make?!?!?

Now, to the point on wind farm... They don't really take up that much acreage... sure they cover allot of ground, but most of them still have farmers plowing those fields (if the fields are plow able) we loose the space that the windturbine takes up, the rest of it still grows what ever the farmer plants (food, or fuel....)



You are right CO2 does increase crop yeilds... though it is also toxic to humans at high enough levels, at which point we won't need go grow crops any more!

Of course, if we are to stop playing god, maybe we should stop digging up the stuff he hid years ago and setting it on fire... Or we could stop messing with the nitrogen cycle... We've been playing god for 100's of years.
 
It seems pretty clear that big brother has done more harm than good. Law and regulations that are put in place by the people can be good and to some extent needed. If it was working according to our Constitution it would be OK. Every regulation is supposed to be reported to congress (house) it is to be reviewed and the house can vote it out. It then goes to the Senate for vote. And here is why this is never done. The president can veto the action against the regulation. The agencies that are under the president. Unless the congress can override the veto the president is making law through regulation. This is unconstitutional. But it is nothing new. It has been going on a long time but has got progressively worse since Woodrow Wilson.
 
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