NC700X replacement battery... AGM?

[werdigo]

After being away for 3 months, I charged the 2014 NC's (original) battery (at least the Sears charger "charged" light was steady), started the bike and rode 10 miles, then stopped for gas. Click-click, black screen... My jump battery was relaxing at home, where I wished I was, but a friend brought one out. With it, the bike fired instantly. He followed me home, just to be sure.

At 8 years and other similar trouble, it may be time for a new one. I've scanned over "battery" threads but still wonder if there's a clear recommendation for AGM as a replacement for my YTZ12S. I saw a Wal-Mart price of $85. Non-AGMs have internet prices in the $35 range.

 

[670cc]

After being away for 3 months, I charged the 2014 NC's (original) battery (at least the Sears charger "charged" light was steady), started the bike and rode 10 miles, then stopped for gas. Click-click, black screen... My jump battery was relaxing at home, where I wished I was, but a friend brought one out. With it, the bike fired instantly. He followed me home, just to be sure.

At 8 years and other similar trouble, it may be time for a new one. I've scanned over "battery" threads but still wonder if there's a clear recommendation for AGM as a replacement for my YTZ12S. I saw a Wal-Mart price of $85. Non-AGMs have internet prices in the $35 range.

The Yuasa YTZ12S is an AGM battery. I haven’t come across anything better for an AGM, but I would recommend the Motocross brand YTZ12S, as it is Yuasa’s alternative, less expensive line that is a regular Yuasa with a different label and a lower price. They will still run $90+ for the YTZ12S, but I am happy with the performance and lifespan.

8 years of battery life is typical for me, so I actually replace Yuasa AGM batteries at 8 years as a proactive measure.

 

[Klap]

I have tried all kinds of batteries, and honestly, it seems as if the care received is more important than the brand. I typically get 6-7 years out of cheap, Chinese AGM batteries. My most recent 3 batteries were AGMs from Chromebattery.com, and both I am now using are over 4 years old.
I use a Battery Minder on both of them, switching between the two bikes, and let it charge for two one hour periods a day ( on a timer). Supposedly, it charges them up, then goes into a desulphating mode.
Non-original Yuasa batteries don’t seem to be any better than the cheaper AGMs in my experience. For some odd reason, the original Honda batteries seem to be more robust, unlike original equipment tires.

 

[werdigo]

My local Battery Warehouse, with whom I've dealt for years (including 6v antique-car batteries), had a Powersonic PTZ12S at $80. I bought it, installed it, and fired up the NC. Pleasant sound.

Thanks for the advice. This is a great group!

 

[TheIronWarrior]

When the 7-8 year old battery in my 2012 kicked it, I went with the cheapest battery I could find, which was an AJC brand ATZ12S at about 50CAD sticker price, 80CAD shipped directly to my door.
Been running for 2 seasons with no issues. Considering a replacement YTZ12S would set me back 250CAD, if I get at least another half-season out of it, I've saved money.
Note, almost every winter the bike is stored indoors (heated) on a tender. One winter she weathered outside in a snowbank.

 

[alloo66]

I've gone with a $35 battery from Walmart. No Problems.

 

[670cc]

For those that replace a 7-8 year old OEM battery with a far less expensive option, I would be interested in knowing if the replacement also lasts 7-8 years. If it does, you made the right decision. Of course, we may not know for quite a while.

 

[TheIronWarrior]

For those that replace a 7-8 year old OEM battery with a far less expensive option, I would be interested in knowing if the replacement also lasts 7-8 years. If it does, you made the right decision. Of course, we may not know for quite a while.

Considering the 7-8 year life of the OEM battery would cost over 3 times the price of the cheaper option, if I get 3 years out of it, I'm still ahead:
250CAD/8yr=31.25CAD/yr
80CAD/31.25(CAD/yr)=2.56yr
Anything over 2 and a half years is gravy.

I'm at the end of year 2 with zero battery issues so far. I'll let you know halfway through Summer 2022

 

[670cc]

Considering the 7-8 year life of the OEM battery would cost over 3 times the price of the cheaper option, if I get 3 years out of it, I'm still ahead:
250CAD/8yr=31.25CAD/yr
80CAD/31.25(CAD/yr)=2.56yr
Anything over 2 and a half years is gravy.

I'm at the end of year 2 with zero battery issues so far. I'll let you know halfway through Summer 2022

Yes, you would be ahead from a monetary standpoint. However, at the 2 years age point, are you going to be as confident with the cheaper battery when leaving on a 3 or 4 week trip, as you would be if you expected the battery to last 7-8 years.

If I’m riding locally, I’m fine running with tires or batteries that may die or wear out at any time. When heading out on a long trip, often those items need to be replaced well before expected end of life, just to avoid problems far away from home. That’s why I prefer things that generally last longer, even if the overall cost per year or mile is higher.

Lastly, I currently own 18 vehicle/boat/RV/tractor/mower batteries that I monitor and maintain. That does not count all-electric vehicles. Batteries need to last a long time, otherwise frequent battery replacements would be a hassle. I count on them lasting 5-8 years each.

 

[lootzyan]

Buying a new battery and replacing your old one is fairly easy. From the observation of this forum and similar forums, it appears that proper care of the battery to ensure long-term functionality is not so simple for many and commonly used. And this despite the fact that the YUASA Technical Manual - Powersports Batteries gives detailed instructions on how to care for their batteries. This manual is quite easily available on the web.

 

[670cc]

Buying a new battery and replacing your old one is fairly easy. From the observation of this forum and similar forums, it appears that proper care of the battery to ensure long-term functionality is not so simple for many and commonly used. And this despite the fact that the YUASA Technical Manual - Powersports Batteries gives detailed instructions on how to care for their batteries. This manual is quite easily available on the web.

I agree. One other major factor for battery longevity is the climate in which the motorcycle is used. Anecdotal evidence gathered from this forum strongly suggests that storing and riding a motorcycle in very hot climates severely shortens it’s battery’s life. Even with best efforts to maintain a battery used in a hot climate, the lifespan of the battery may still be short.

Along with that goes off season storage practices. I keep my batteries charged over winter, but store them is a cold, unheated building. Despite old wive’s tales recommending batteries be brought into heated spaces in winter, I believe cold storage is the ticket for long battery life.

For the NC, it doesn’t help battery life that the battery is mounted right above the engine.

 

[Klap]

For those that replace a 7-8 year old OEM battery with a far less expensive option, I would be interested in knowing if the replacement also lasts 7-8 years. If it does, you made the right decision. Of course, we may not know for quite a while.

I just replaced a 7 year old Scorpion battery in my ST1300, not because it was really bad ( still started well, no clock resets, etc), but because I was doing a long ride in PA, and did not want to risk it going south while I was out. It was 48$ delivered to my door.

 

[TheIronWarrior]

Yes, you would be ahead from a monetary standpoint. However, at the 2 years age point, are you going to be as confident with the cheaper battery when leaving on a 3 or 4 week trip, as you would be if you expected the battery to last 7-8 years.

If I’m riding locally, I’m fine running with tires or batteries that may die or wear out at any time. When heading out on a long trip, often those items need to be replaced well before expected end of life, just to avoid problems far away from home. That’s why I prefer things that generally last longer, even if the overall cost per year or mile is higher.

Lastly, I currently own 18 vehicle/boat/RV/tractor/mower batteries that I monitor and maintain. That does not count all-electric vehicles. Batteries need to last a long time, otherwise frequent battery replacements would be a hassle. I count on them lasting 5-8 years each.

For me, if I was leaving on a 3 or 4 week trip with a battery of unknown life, I'd do one of three things:
1) Get my replacement battery early (especially if I had reason to believe the battery was nearing end of life)
2) Make sure I was traveling in areas that replacements were available if required enroute (not always possible)
2) Get a portable booster pack or a list of numbers for tow companies (or both)
Note, I have no reason yet to believe the off-brand battery is any less reliable than the OEM, so I would probably just go on my trip with no confidence concerns unless I knew I would be away from any form of support for an extended distance/period of time.
Also note if I just replaced the battery on schedule every 3 years whether there was life left in it or not, I'd still be saving money assuming an average 8 year life from the OEM battery.

The choice between cost/reliability/convenience/other is certainly a personal choice and I'm not going to tell you that you're wrong for having different priorities than I do. Especially where you have such a large fleet, your needs and wants are going to be different than mine.

 

[670cc]

For me, if I was leaving on a 3 or 4 week trip with a battery of unknown life, I'd do one of three things:
1) Get my replacement battery early (especially if I had reason to believe the battery was nearing end of life)
2) Make sure I was traveling in areas that replacements were available if required enroute (not always possible)
2) Get a portable booster pack or a list of numbers for tow companies (or both)
Note, I have no reason yet to believe the off-brand battery is any less reliable than the OEM, so I would probably just go on my trip with no confidence concerns unless I knew I would be away from any form of support for an extended distance/period of time.
Also note if I just replaced the battery on schedule every 3 years whether there was life left in it or not, I'd still be saving money assuming an average 8 year life from the OEM battery.

The choice between cost/reliability/convenience/other is certainly a personal choice and I'm not going to tell you that you're wrong for having different priorities than I do. Especially where you have such a large fleet, your needs and wants are going to be different than mine.

I agree with your logic. The price of the battery may have no direct correlation to the battery life. Hence that is why I asked if low cost batteries are actually providing a long life (7-8 years). If so, that is by far the best overall value. The two low cost batteries I had experience with died young at inconvenient times, thus I have avoided them ever since. On the other hand, Yuasa batteries are not infallible. There was a time when Yuasa batteries were mysteriously dying early with an open internal circuit.

You take your chances.

 

[lootzyan]

... The two low cost batteries I had experience with died young at inconvenient times, thus I have avoided them ever since. ...

We are always tempted to buy cheaper, too often with a poor end result.
I too often forget the rule: "We are too poor to buy cheap"

 

[showkey]

I will add that “sudden death“ is the common failure mode of modern batteries. Meaning good no hint of a problem or concern* that morning …….stop for fuel or food ……….no crank, no start, solenoid clicking etc.


*Problem, concern is slow crank or low battery power Or other warning the battery is dying.

 

[TheIronWarrior]

We are always tempted to buy cheaper, too often with a poor end result.
I too often forget the rule: "We are too poor to buy cheap"

In general, you get what you pay for. Unfortunately, sometimes what you pay for is company branding. Other times, the more expensive unit is more than worth the cost difference.
I would be interested in seeing some real life data on the battery life for the YTZ and several cheaper options. Maybe we can open a thread to conduct a statistical assessment of battery life for brans/off-brand batteries. (Yes, I am a data nerd, no I will not apologize )

Ultimately though, if paying more for a known brand is important to you because of the confidence it instills (whether actual or perceived) then that's the right choice for you.

Tangentially related, a friend of mine used to fly cargo for a small regional carrier. The aircraft cargo door was supported by 4 gas charged cylinders. These were identical to the cargo door cylinders on the Dodge Caravan, had the Chrysler logo and everything. The cost per unit was something like 200x the cost of the automobile part because they were now an aircraft part. To be fair, they pulled comparatively more units off the production line for testing (slightly higher reliability) and stuck an aircraft manufacturer sticker on it (next to, but not over top of, the Chrysler logo) but they were physically the exact same part. This is an extreme example, but sometimes most of what you're paying for is the logo.

 

[sandman20]

I've been using Chrome and Scorpion replacement batteries in my bikes for years. In more than a few instances, they outlived the Yuasa OEM batteries. I can usually agree that you get what you pay for but I'm not sure about that when it comes to power sport batteries.