Steering damper...

[LA_NC700X]

Hi All,

Just wondering if steering damper available for NC700X...

Thanks

 

[Bug Dr.]

I'm curious too. I just took my hands off of the bars going about 45-50 mph. Wow! It would have turned into a tank slapper if I hadn't put my hands back on the bars. Unnerving to say the least. First bike I've ever owned that does this. I need to find a cure for it quickly.
Mike

 

[HONDABIKEPRO]

I'm curious too. I just took my hands off of the bars going about 45-50 mph. Wow! It would have turned into a tank slapper if I hadn't put my hands back on the bars. Unnerving to say the least. First bike I've ever owned that does this. I need to find a cure for it quickly.
Mike

there is nothing wrong with the bike. it is designed to have both hand on the bars. taking both hand of the bars is reckless driving in the view of the police. one of my techs just got a 400.00 ticket for just doing that. dale

 

[Angry Outcast]

I have taken my hands off the bars many times at speeds from 30 to 70 and had no issue. And yes, I know its viewed as reckless by the police but so is dragging a knee on a set of twisties but that hasnt stopped me yet...

 

[Mr_Krabs]

Check your tire pressure. That can affect handling too. I've taken my hands off at freeway speeds and coasted down to 35 without issue.

 

[Beemerphile]

I would rather be wreckless than reckless. But if mine went in a wobble from a brief hands-free I'd be trying to find out what's up. I'd check tire wear and pressure (both ends), steering head bearings, and rear wheel alignment. I have seen a rear end issue manifest itself before as a front-end wobble. It should not take a steering damper to fix this. At least, my undamped bike doesn't do it.

 

[Spaceteach]

Gotta agree with Beemerphile, something isn't right if an NC goes into that kind of wobble. I've really only heard of the need for a damper on bikes with really quick steering geometry and high horsepower output. I don't think the NC fits into either category.

Bob

 

[yticolev]

There are mechanical issues that can cause such speed wobbles that should be checked out. But it is far more likely that your input caused it. A jiggle on the handlebar before releasing it, some instability in your riding position. If you try to replicate it (be safe), see if something as simple as a knee on a tank makes it go away.

As it happens, I took my hands off the bar at speed today and the bike went straight and true. But I have a lot of experience in speed wobbles in bicycles and it can be induced in almost any of them with rider input. On the worst offenders (I know having built such a frame myself), it can be hard to stop but those are very rare bicycles. And bicycles are wimpy structurally compared to motorcycles - of course the engine HP is two orders of magnitude different as well - but power is not the primary cause of wobbles in my experience.

 

[Bug Dr.]

I lifted my hands from the bars 7 to 8 times and it wobbled with increasing frequency every time. At first, the bars would be calm and then the wobble would build and get worse until I placed my hands back on the bars. I've never noticed anything unusual when riding (both hands on the bars). I guess today was the first time since I've owned the bike that both hands were removed from the bars. I will check tire pressures first.

Dale, I have to respectfully disagree with you here. Nothing I did was reckless and I certainly do not think this is a normal condition for any motorcycle.
Mike

 

[showkey]

Hands off the bars "head shake" sometimes started by a bump of the bars or a bump in the road can have a many causes...... sometimes can be a very normal condition. Think that is where the comment comes from do not remove hands from the bars. Some new riders experience this head shake for the first time while zippering a jacket etc and are surprised.

This has been written up on many forums and many different bikes........the keys are hands off the bars and deceleration. High speed wobbles and high speed weaves is a whole different senerio and should not be combined as one size fits all.

Things that play a part and make it more obvious:
tire inflation
tires (tread and wear)
steering head bearings adjustment
swing arm bearings
huge wind screens
handle bar mounted wind screens
high weight in the rear trunk
suspension changes in bad way
simply moving forward on the seat can change this condition

or back to the start do not let go of the bars beleive it or not your hands and arms are part of the steering system.

It would be an error to automaticaly jump to the conclusion the bike is "broken" for hands off bars decel shake.

 

[netizen]

I've ridden my VFR many many miles without either hand on the bars steering with my knees. The VFR is very stable at speed and the only time I ever had any wobble was when the tire weight fell off the front tire causing it to go out of balance. I haven't ridden much on the NCX that way yet, as I only have about 600 miles on her and I have not gotten to know her well enough yet to know if it is safe to ride that way on her. The NCX also has a much more upright riding position making it easier to ride distance with your hands on the bars.

I'd estimate I've ridden 20,000 miles with no hands on the bars on my VFR and never had an accident. It is just more comfortable riding that way especially if your riding distance.

I think it depends on the setup of your bike as to whether it is safe to ride that way. I know some bikes are not stable at all without at least one hand on the bars.

I'm interested to see if a cure is found for the shaking for those who are experiencing this problem.

 

[Bug Dr.]

After checking everything and trying to think if I had removed both hands previously without problems, I've come to the conclusion that the shimmy that my bike now experiences when my hands are removed from the bars is caused by the added weight I've added to the rear of the bike. I do remember driving without hands to unzip my vents of my riding gear (before I installed luggage) without incident. The only logical conclusion I can draw is that the extra weight on the rear is upsetting the front when the bars are unattended.

So, if you are loaded down in the back be careful when if/when you remove both hands from the bars. You might experience the same thing I did.

I need to remove the luggage and try to repeat the shimmy. If it doesn't happen, I will know for certain that it is the luggage.
Mike

 

[westgl]

All The Honda bike's i have had, Honda uses very cheap stem bearings, I have a few Goldwings, take ONE hand off (even when stem bearings are torqued to spec) while slowing down you get a front end vibration.

Switch from OEM Ball Bearings that are in a Plastic Race,

A lot more surface contact area to Tapered bearings than there is on Ball bearings, also plastic race vs steel Race

TO:
Manufacturer name, "All Balls", Tapered bearings in a steel Race, this make the Goldwing Much more solid feeling and turns it into a great handling bike.

On the Goldwing it eliminated ALL front end Vibration.

They may not be available yet for the NCX

 

[L.B.S.]

I don't think there's anything "wrong" per se with the NC700X as far as needing a steering damper, or having cheap steering stem bearings, whatever, but I was a little surprised that mine will wag the bars ever so gently when I take my hands off.

I thought for sure with the generous rake and trail numbers, low COG, and the rather long wheelbase, that the thing would be virtually Supertanker stable, so was nonplussed when I experienced the: "did this bike just start to wag it's bars just now?!" for the first time.

I have not actually owned very many bikes out of the 20 or so over the years, that did this. (No matter the provocation-decelerating/accelerating/bumps/knackered bearings/low tire pressure etc.)

 

[L.B.S.]

Switch from OEM Ball Bearings that are in a Plastic Race,

! I've never seen plastic races in any of my bikes. Which models of yours had these?

Agreed on the tapered roller bearing swap out, that's one thing I've usually done to all my bikes too.

 

[dersan]

sometimes i got my hands off to close my schubert helmet chin.But no woobles

 

[HONDABIKEPRO]

I lifted my hands from the bars 7 to 8 times and it wobbled with increasing frequency every time. At first, the bars would be calm and then the wobble would build and get worse until I placed my hands back on the bars. I've never noticed anything unusual when riding (both hands on the bars). I guess today was the first time since I've owned the bike that both hands were removed from the bars. I will check tire pressures first.

Dale, I have to respectfully disagree with you here. Nothing I did was reckless and I certainly do not think this is a normal condition for any motorcycle.
Mike

i did not say that you did anything reckless, the police consider taking both hands off the bars to be reckless driving in this state, and you may get a ticket for it. with that said i have learned riding bikes to never take both hands off the bars, at the same time or some day you may not like the results. anything with two wheels is normally unstable period, but the engineers design as much of this, a possible out of the bike so that it is ride able. the steering , steering head angle, fork angle, and trail help control,
how the bike handles, your arms add to these angles, and are factored in, for a end result that will work in most cases. ball bearings in the steering head are not installed there with cost cutting in mind. normally most people will not feel the stickshon that taper bearings add to steering, compared to ball bearings, BUT the engineers who are making this bike have to pay attention to this. if you install taper bearings and over torque them to stop the shaking on decell, with no hands on the bars, the steering does get heavier, AND YOU WILL LOSE FEED BACK FROM THE FRONT TIRE. if the bike is stock, being ridden, like it was designed to be ridden, then it will normally not shake on decell if it does you should check it over closely. installing tapered bearings is not the fix, just a cover up. dale

 

[showkey]

! I've never seen plastic races in any of my bikes. Which models of yours had these?

.

I think (guess) they are talking about plastic ball bearing cage (ball holders) in the bearing not plastic races........... terminology problem, cage material has little and nothing to do with the quality or performace of a ball bearing.

 

[cdnuser]

I was riding with my buddy who has a CBR 1000 repsol. It was fairly windy and his bike was straight as an arrow and I was bouncing all over. His bike does have a top notch steering damper though. Starting wonder if the front nose of the NC is causing it to be affected by wind turbulence.

 

[MZ5]

This is a timely thread! I was coasting toward a stoplight recently, and noticed that my NCX shakes its head a bit as it decelerates through from 40 - 35 mph. It doesn't do it really bad, but it's distinct with hands off the bars. Doesn't seem to do it significantly outside that speed range. I was thinking of asking here whether anyone else had experienced the issue, but got busy and didn't think any more about it until this evening when I read this.

I recall the older CR500s shaking their heads so badly (at speed, off-road) you were sure you were going to wreck, and that was even _with_ your hands on the bars! A good damper was almost mandatory on some years of those bikes. Kawi's contemporary KX500 didn't do it, so clearly steering geometry was to blame. IIRC, Honda got rid of the problem, or at least significantly reduced it, in subsequent model years.

Anyway, I can't say I care for a street bike that shakes its head. It also is in no way inherent with a well-designed bike, as evidenced by my CBR600F4, which would only shake its head briefly upon up-shifting after a full-power roll-on acceleration run from first gear. That's a bit of a special situation, though, that one really shouldn't call head-shake. You see, the 'shake' was simply the front end going back to straight-ahead once the front wheel regained contact with the ground during the shift.

Seriously, though, my NCX doesn't shake its head very bad, and it calms back down after running through the 'critical' speed range. It's also quite a lot 'easier' to steer at speed than the CBR was. The CBR was an extremely stable bike, despite being very quick-handling when you asked it to be. The design characteristics which give the NCX its super-easy steering effort are almost certainly to blame for the mild shaking on at least some machines.