What's up w/ the OEM Tires?

[Arcusx]

I remember seeing some grumbling here about the OEM tires not being very good. Then, when I took delivery, the salesman said something to the affect that they really needed to be broken in for the first hundred or so miles before I started really leaning in on any turns. What's the scoop? And what's recommended to replace them?

Thanks

 

[shadowsmurf]

All tires have a break in period, whether they are OEM or not. From reading the forums I would say that the OEM tires are not raved about, but they are not horrible. Lets just sat there are average/mediocre, with all that implies. I would check out the tire tech talk forum, there are several threads there by people with more knowledge about tires.

 

[bamamate]

As shadowsmurf said all new tires have a break-in period. During manufacturing of the tire a mold release agent is used to keep the tire from sticking to the mold. That makes the tires slippery until it is worn off and the rubber needs to go through a few heat/cold cycles to fully break-in.
My NC came with the Z8s. I had no issue with them except the tire life wasn’t as long as I would like so I’ve switched to Michelin PR3s. The Z8s were quiet, sure footed and surprised me how well they did in the rain. So far the PR3s are noisier but feel better off-road.

 

[Old Can Ride]

Bamamate you are 110% correct! During manufacturing of the tire a mold release agent is used to keep the tire from sticking to the mold. "Paraffin wax" acts as an antiozonant by the means of formation of a surface barrier to keep the tire from sticking to the mold. What is paraffin? Used in candle wax and soap. This is used in all types of tires, including auto and motorcycles. The motorcycle tire manufactures ask that you do not ride a new tire in the rain for the first 100 miles until the paraffin is worn off. Your on two wheels, so in the rain is about like stepping on soup in the shower, and down you go.

The Bridgestone Touring 023 that comes stock on some of the NC700 is really a good tire for the roadway. Some of us like to travel a lot of dirt roads, so knobby is what these guys want. For the NC700 most of the dirt road guys recommend : Continental Twinduro TKC80 Dual Sport Tires 120/70-17 (front) and Heidenau K60 150/70-17 (rear)

 

[Mike Cash]

I sometimes haul "mold release agent" from a small factory that manufactures it and ships it worldwide. There is a lot of stuff in it, but essentially the stuff is "oil".

 

[Mr_Krabs]

All new tires are slick. This is a hilarious example of how slick they are. One good blip mid turn and you're sliding and bound to fall down. When I get new tires I scrub them down with a degreaser like greased lightning and stiff scrub brush. It really gets the mold release off but even then they're not 100% grippy until they're ridden in and that can take time depending on how often I visit the twisties.

Brand new Gixxer crashed - YouTube

 

[n30r3l0ad3d]

Heh, they have no grip in the rain compared to my dunlop elite III's on my other honda as I found out the other night. I had the rear tire kick out on me twice. The other thing I noticed is when cold they make road noise. It eventually goes away as you ride.

I am not impressed with them so far.

 

[Old Can Ride]

Which tires do you have on your NC700? I agree for a big touring bike that the Dunlop Touring Elite III is the best.

 

[Mr_Krabs]

Heh, they have no grip in the rain compared to my dunlop elite III's on my other honda as I found out the other night. I had the rear tire kick out on me twice. The other thing I noticed is when cold they make road noise. It eventually goes away as you ride.

I am not impressed with them so far.

Dunlop Elite 3's would be great, if they came in the NC's size. Which they don't. You'll always have a compromise in wet grip vs dry grip. The Z8's are actually pretty decent tires with excellent handling but in the wet they're not the best. Sure you can get a tire that handles great wet and dry but those generally don't last as long. I'd have to ask what kind of bike can outhandle the NC on Dunlop Elite 3's because those tires are made pretty much just for cruisers. I'm sure if you compared the real handling of the cruiser sure it won't slide as much in the rain simply because you can't push a cruiser nearly as hard as the NC in a turn so in the wet the cruiser doesn't kick out simply because you can't push it as hard without scraping parts.

 

[dduelin]

As already said, all new tires need a scrubbing in period. The NC comes with Bridgestone 023s or Metzeler Z8s. The OP did not specify.

Mine came on Z8s and it is an excellent OEM tire. I liked the grip level wet and dry and the tire tested at the top of its class in wet pavement grip in an objective tire test in Germany two years ago. No tire came deliver 100% traction on wet or dry paint stripes, oil spots, metal drains and access covers, etc. but on smooth clean pavement the Z8 gives at least 75% of dry grip. It's not a typical OEM fitment tire - they are very good tires. I ran one rear to 8000 miles and replaced it with another. That one got a hole in it and I replaced the set with Michelin PR3s at 14,000 miles. The PR3s are also a very good tire, especially in the wet but the handling is not as good as the Z8s. I knew this from experience with them on my other bike and on the NC but they will give about 40 or 50% more mileage in exchange for a little numbness in feel. In the wet they can't be beat.

I ran Bridgestone 023s on my ST1300 in a beta test for BS in 2009 before the tires were released for general sale but I have not fitted them to my NC. I rate the tire better than the OEM ST1300 tire but below that of Metzeler Z6s which preceded the current Z8 and above the Michelin PR2 which preceded the current PR3. I consider the BS023 a good tire, typical OEM. It did everything well just not top of class and the mileage was no better than other offerings from competitors. They are a good value as the price per set has dropped over time and the new Bridgestone T30 replaces the 023 in the product line up so they should become even cheaper.

 

[duk2n]

Mine came on Z8s, and recently (8K miles rear, 10K miles front) I changed them to BT023s. To me they both are good tyres, I only hope to get a better mileage from the BT023s.

 

[n30r3l0ad3d]

Dunlop Elite 3's would be great, if they came in the NC's size. Which they don't. You'll always have a compromise in wet grip vs dry grip. The Z8's are actually pretty decent tires with excellent handling but in the wet they're not the best.

My Z8's handled like crap. I know it's not the way I rode either. When the rear tire kicked out twice, it was under light acceleration from a take off. I can't imagine what it will be like during the fall, when wet leaf's make an appearance on the road around here. And as I said, the Z8's make road noise when cold. Mabe I got a bad set of Z8's? If anyone needs a stock rear replacement tire and doesn't mind a small hole in the tire (for a tube replacment) I have one for sale in the forums with pics. http://nc700-forum.com/forum/bikes-parts-sale/3492-rear-stock-metzeler-tire.html Make an offer. You are correct, they don't make E3's for our bike (I thought they did, and that's a bummer). They recommend in Dunlop:

Sportmax Roadsmart II
SIZE:120/70ZR17
MAX LOAD AT PSI:36
FRONT RIM SIZE:3.50x17

Sportmax Roadsmart II
SIZE:160/60ZR17
MAX LOAD AT PSI:42
REAR RIM SIZE:4.50x17

So these are the tires I will most likely get when my Z8's wear out.

 

[Old Can Ride]

I am 6000 miles into my second set of bridestone 023. I also owe a wing with Dunlop elite 3. Both are very good tires and I have no problems with either brand.

 

[RyC]

Agree that the Z8 are crap....also slipped and slide from non aggressive takeoff and in the wet they had no grip (tires where warm)

I also had the chance to drive an NC with the Battleaxe tires and the grip and road feel where much better...instilled a lot more confidence while riding

I will be looking at PR3 before the rainy season starts.

 

[Vescol]

Agree with RyC and others. Z8 are crap period!. Can't want to put on Michelin PR3

 

[dduelin]

Well I can't argue with that. I liked the Z8s and know that some bikes with 110+ hp come equipped with them. I think the 45-50 hp of a NC700 would have a hard time overwhelming any decent tire but I suppose anything is possible.

 

[n30r3l0ad3d]

Don't get me wrong on the Z8's, they grip pretty good on dry pavement and are more for sport than touring according to a tire performance chart I ran across.

 

[buckshot]

I found the Z8s to be good on dry pavement, but that was it. The rear was always slipping in the wet, and I was not impressed with how long it lasted. I just got back from a local dealer with a new Pirelli Angel ST on the back of my bike. It has 6500 KM on it, and i could see the belts/cords on the left side of my Z8. The service tech asked if I had been doing burnouts and thought I had at least 10k on the bike. Nope, I just enjoy a good twisty road. I won't be running a Z8 on my bike again.

 

[tooblekain]

I disagree 100% about the whole "breaking in of tires." On the track the tires are best brand new. Imagine doing the whole 100 miles to break them in. For me by 100 miles they are close to worn out! Then they may mention scrubbing tires. Well, how are you supposed to scrub off the last centimeter of tire's edge if you never get there on the street?

It can be argued that you need "scrub tires" in because of the "mold release chemicals." That may be been true probably a decade ago but not today. There have been many arguments that people crash because of their tires. I see this all the time when at the canyons and even at the track. News flash---it's not the tires...it's you, the rider. I have ridden in really shagged tires at high speeds on the track where I was way past the thread and actually shredding the inner layer of rubber. By that time the tire was dancing around.

The whole breaking in is not the tire..it's the rider getting used to them. Of course there is the other idea of warming up the tires. But tires these days (especially street tires) warm up a lot faster than dedicated DOT race tires or race slicks.

I have used countless combinations of tires and find the best time a tire offers maximum grip is when it's brand new.

Since tires (whether current or protyping R&D for new generation of tires) are really pushed to it's limits on the racetrack or test track and not the street, I still stick to my guns that breaking in a tire is B.S.

 

[dduelin]

This is a common sense thing not a hard and fast rule. For years tire manufacturers advise taking it easy on new or remounted tires for 50 miles. This is mostly for the know nothings that play Ricky Racer as soon as they leave the dealership on new tires then get a lawyer to sue the tire mfg and the dealership after they wad up their bike on the way home. It's also a fair warning to newer riders than might inadvertently over do it on a brand new tire. Seasoned street riders will just take it easy for a few miles and gradually increase lean angle to scuff up the tire to the lean angles they normally ride at. Remounted or new tires with still-wet mounting lube under the tire bead can slip on the rim under hard acceleration or braking and tear the tube at the valve. Nearly all MC tires today are tubeless and won't have a tube to ruin but the old adage to take it easy for 50 miles dies hard.

At the street-bike-at-the track days I attended we always let out quite a bit of air pressure with street tires so the tires would heat up much faster and to a higher temperature than normally reached in street riding. The warning to scrub in new tires doesn't really apply on a track bike where the tire heats up to operating temperature in a few laps or was heated under tire warmers and is ready for maximum performance as soon as the bike rolls onto the track.