First valve adjustment heads up

[Banjoferg]

Agreed itlives. This is the only forum I've been able to stay on for more than a few months...no matter the subject. Other than this post and a couple about pulling chicks and talons, this forum is great. I may be pretty quiet on here but I've definitely learned a ton.

 

[lootzyan]

Rennie made a post after post #3, edited it, then deleted it. There may have been content that is now missing that subsequent posts refer to, adding to the confusion of the present casual observer.

Thank you for clarification.
Was deleted post bad enough so it might justify #5 nasty reply?
I didn't see Rennie’s angry (must be) reaction but I think I can understand why it was drastic. Surely he got good intentions to give us a heads up. So, without knowing his experience, why question his ability how to measure valve clearance? If I know and understand principles of 4-stroke engine and I understand camshaft design, do I have to follow service manual for valve clearance inspection? Service manual is not ultimate source of information. Btw, erroneous information was published in out of U.S. (and Canada?) service manuals.
Yes, is helpful at the beginning. But after many times doing that, I easily can learn a simplified and more efficient way. And I’m sure Rennie can easily do the same.
So why question his experience without knowing s#$%t about him. Turns out he has a proper training. What about you Dr. Bug?
If I understand modern production and assembly processes, I may know that everything is automated as much as possible. Inserting valve adjusting screw into a rocker arm also. Accuracy is high, let’s say 99.9 % even with selective quality control (it’s not Rolls). So on 1000 units 1 can be out of spec. And this is what happened to Rennie. Business as usual for Honda… but not here.
You're right Rennie, it was waste of time.

 

[Bug Dr.]

You think my reply (No. 5) was nasty? Oh, please! Rennie was trying to help what/who by posting? Many people here have checked their valves.....some several times and nobody has found them the way that he did. He hasn't seen all of the threads that elude to such?

Back to his valves....yes, that is a little odd and his condition would be considered an outlier statistically speaking. Several were quick to point out that if he used the manual it might contain flawed information and to recheck.......people actually trying to be helpful. And how did he treat them? By being condescending and pointing out the fact that he didn't need any help.....which he might not. All of his valves might actually be out of spec.....I really don't care. That's not the point of my "nasty" comment. Don't come here and post results of your valve check and then brow beat the ones that are genuinely trying to help. Thanks but that kind of help isn't needed on this site. This is a very informative forum and one of the best has already been run off of this site by people acting like children.

He could've said something along the lines of "thanks, I will check them again" or "thanks for looking out for my best interest", etc.... but noooooooooooo. He had to inform us of his infallibility and his first rate training that Ma Honda gave him decades ago. I suppose we should be thanking him for enlightening us........whatever.

Am I professionally trained? Do you think a guy that uses the moniker of "Bug Dr." sound like a freakin' mechanic. I am smart enough to read more than I post and if I had a problem with my NC this would be the first place I would come to learn.......not teach.

I don't even own an NC but I come here because I have made friends here from the events that I've hosted and will continue to do so.....I've got other sandboxes to play in and really don't need this crap.
Mike

 

[670cc]

I agree with you, Bug Dr. At around post #4, a simple "thanks for the feedback but I'm confident I performed the valve check correctly", and we would now be on post 6 or 7 of the thread, not up to post 25. Rennie is the one who chose to stomp off in a huff, so I guess we can end this now and move on.

Don't leave us, Mike; this is just a little hiccup on the forum.

 

[itlives]

X2!

I value your input!

 

[lootzyan]

It's sad I have to stand up for Rennie alone (my Alamo), against the highest authority and circle of friends, who suggest to sweep everything under a rug and forget it.
Why? Because you don't have enough courage to admit that you insult a guy first and later you're upset that he didn't say "thank you". Not true?
Does anybody can imagine switching sides with Rennie?
Let's say it's me:
I spent all afternoon in this miserable weather in my garage, took off all s$%#t to have access to valve cover, made a corrections, put everything back. 3 or 4 sweaty hours if I done it first time.
Went on forum to share my experience and maybe get some gratitude in return.
But in a short time I hear authoritarian voice: "It's impossible what you've got. You used wrong manual or even wrong feeler gauges. Go back, do it again and don't forget to say "thank you guys".
Now, everybody has a different temper - but I'd be really pissed.

First of all - why so many times I read: "did I follow manual?"
Maybe I don't have one and don't need it for valve adjustment. Myself, I did it over thousand times (true!) without manual. Rennie maybe done it at least 10 times. Practically there is no different in experience - just the same routine, the same 4-stroke engine type, over and over.

Second – “wrong info in my manual?” - maybe I have one. So I check my manual and everything is very correct. Because error is in European or Australian or ... whatever copy, and I am in Nova Scotia, not in Old one.

Third – maybe somehow I have a copy from Europe (yes, I have in pdf form).
On page 3-11 there are two pictures of camshaft maintenance opening. Shortly, description says to set marks to a top. That is opposite to requirement set in U.S. copy of manual. Whole 180 deg.
What would happen to valves when you turn camshaft by 180 deg.?
If anybody knows only little bit about 4-strokes engine principles and camshaft, knows that is impossible setting. That is why this error was so easily spotted.

But so many angry and disappointed posts here accused me (Rennie) of rejecting helping hand with sh###ty advice.
No, thank you.

So Long, and Thanks for All the Fish.

 

[L.B.S.]

Jeez, no good deed goes unpunished

I'm at a total loss as to what causes people to have melt downs within the space of 2 or 3 replies to a post, in which there was absolutely zero intent to generate such a burst of rage and anger.

Good lord.

 

[glencoeman]

Sad to see people getting upset about a quite easy procedure to adjust valves. As far as I can see, you can ignore the removal of the round cover at the end of the right side of the camshaft. Easiest way is, after removing radiator,spark plugs, left hand round covers on the alternator cover and rocker cover, is to turn the engine counter clockwise and watch the inlet valves of the cylinder that you need to adjust. After the inlet valves start coming back up, slowly turn the engine counter clockwise till the TDC mark appears in the little window. You can check that it is at TDC by gently putting a long rod through the spark plug hole where you should be able to feel that the piston is at TDC and both rocker arms should be able to move. Check valve clearance and adjust if necessary. Repeat procedure for the other cylinder and complete the replacement of parts that you have removed. The Honda manual seems to make it more complicated than it really is.

 

[Deleted member 1183]

Sad to see people getting upset about a quite easy procedure to adjust valves. As far as I can see, you can ignore the removal of the round cover at the end of the right side of the camshaft. Easiest way is, after removing radiator,spark plugs, left hand round covers on the alternator cover and rocker cover, is to turn the engine counter clockwise and watch the inlet valves of the cylinder that you need to adjust. After the inlet valves start coming back up, slowly turn the engine counter clockwise till the TDC mark appears in the little window. You can check that it is at TDC by gently putting a long rod through the spark plug hole where you should be able to feel that the piston is at TDC and both rocker arms should be able to move. Check valve clearance and adjust if necessary. Repeat procedure for the other cylinder and complete the replacement of parts that you have removed. The Honda manual seems to make it more complicated than it really is.

With the exception of the rod, that is more or less what I described above. Good to hear someone else confirm this.

 

[DirtFlier]

I learned a long time ago to turn the crankshaft in the normal direction of rotation while watching the valves open & close and do it several times to fully understand where it is in process. When it comes to a point that appears to be TDC on compression, I check to see if all the rockers for that cylinder are loose. If they are not loose, I turn the crank another 360-degrees while watching for the correct mark, then recheck for loose rockers. Only then do I trust the what I see at the mark.

I've yet to check the valves on my NC but will do so this fall - it has less than 2000 miles because I still have my NT700V.

ps. By the way, it always helps to remove the spark plugs. With the plugs installed, the crank doesn't want to stop at/near TDC!

 

[Ruggybuggy]

I wouldn't worry about it too much guys, he's seen like he runs a little hot and personally who needs it on a great forum like this. Don't let the door hit you in the a$$ on the way out.

 

[itlives]

Agreed RugBug.
If I were a mod, I would close this mangled thread.