I don't understand this:

670cc

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This rider may not live a very long life.
 

fiah

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I'm not sure if he just has no idea how to corner a bike properly or if he knows and is just being a complete knucklehead on purpose
 

tew47

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He is simply pressing on the handlebar to go left or right and bending at the hips and letting the motorcycle move under him. Do it all the time. You can change your path of travel quickly that way.
 

GerJ

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I have the impression he is desperately trying to scrape the footrests over the pavement.
 

Cigar Mike

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It is how you turn off-road. By pushing the handle bars down and weighting the outside peg it increases grip in the dirt. It is also a method used in supermoto. If the tire breaks loose you can control the slide instead of low siding. Being an off road rider most of my motorcycling life it is hard to change to hanging off the inside. The upright position is effective but has it's limits. It is the method I still use when riding DS bikes on pavement. You do bring the dreaded high side into play when you make a big mistake. At high speed the low side is preferred and is promoted by hanging on the inside.
 

davidc83

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He is riding the bike as if he is riding motocross or enduro on gravel roads; if the tires slide out, it is easier to pull the bike up instead of low sliding. I have a klx250sf and I usually do curves (when I can find them-keep it stored in Florida), and with its short wheelbase, very easy to go around curves quickly by using this method (even on pavement), but don't make any mistakes in using this method (in the video, he almost made a few major mistakes by not pulling the bike upright under him in time).
 

supertux1

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He's riding 'crossed up', counterweighting the outside peg so he can induce more lean angle in order to turn sharper.

Riding on the edge of the tire like that deforms the contact patch and reduces total traction available. (Edit: Also introduces increased lateral forces and reduces the effectiveness of up/down suspension parts...)

It's fine on a dirtbike where there are knobbies all the way around and breaking the rear free with a blip of throttle is a legitimate way to steer.

On the street it's the sort of thing you do when making a U-turn on a narrow road, scrubbing in new tires in a parking lot etc... doing it in a high speed turn on the road is a great way to slide into oncoming traffic...

I used to ride my NC like that, leaning the bike beneath me and staying upright. A kindly instructor in the MSF Advanced Rider Course had me try hanging off instead, so now I do that even though it feels weird.

OTOH: Mick Doohan won a lot of races 'doing it wrong', much depends on your tires and smoothness.

mick-doohan-five-times-500c-world-champion.jpg
 
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vitesse

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Do you think he might be setting up to exit the corner and shifting the peg pressure and body position?
 

supertux1

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davidc83

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He's riding 'crossed up', counterweighting the outside peg so he can induce more lean angle in order to turn sharper.

Riding on the edge of the tire like that deforms the contact patch and reduces total traction available. (Edit: Also introduces increased lateral forces and reduces the effectiveness of up/down suspension parts...)

It's fine on a dirtbike where there are knobbies all the way around and breaking the rear free with a blip of throttle is a legitimate way to steer.

On the street it's the sort of thing you do when making a U-turn on a narrow road, scrubbing in new tires in a parking lot etc... doing it in a high speed turn on the road is a great way to slide into oncoming traffic...

I used to ride my NC like that, leaning the bike beneath me and staying upright. A kindly instructor in the MSF Advanced Rider Course had me try hanging off instead, so now I do that even though it feels weird.

OTOH: Mick Doohan won a lot of races 'doing it wrong', much depends on your tires and smoothness.

View attachment 30790
I am sorry, but riding hard into a corner either street style or dirt style is still going to be using the same contact point on the tire; depends on the skill of the rider. It also depends on the tire.
On the below picture (sorry, cheap phone picture), is the rear Conti Motion Pro-the contact point goes way over and curves around the side of the tire and ends just above the lettering on the tire. I have been close to the edge (as far as my skills allow) with no problems. If the rider knows how to ride dirt style on street, there shouldn't be any problem with tire and its contact point.
 

supertux1

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I am sorry, but riding hard into a corner either street style or dirt style is still going to be using the same contact point on the tire; depends on the skill of the rider. It also depends on the tire.
On the below picture (sorry, cheap phone picture), is the rear Conti Motion Pro-the contact point goes way over and curves around the side of the tire and ends just above the lettering on the tire. I have been close to the edge (as far as my skills allow) with no problems. If the rider knows how to ride dirt style on street, there shouldn't be any problem with tire and its contact point.
I'm sorry I should have elaborated... there's two kinds of 'contact' area -- apparent contact area and true contact area. The apparent contact area for most tires is the size of credit card at almost all lean angles and may actually increase as the tire is rolled towards 45 degrees. This is what tire manufacturers like to show you. This is the contact area represented by just the tire - no bike or rider - with its own weight sitting gingerly on a dry road.

Now you put a couple hundred pounds of force on that tire in the form of a bike and a rider and send the thing down a wet road at speed and you now have what is the 'true contact area' -- the force between the two materials as it mashes the peaks and valleys of the irregular materials together determines the true contact area. Less weight = Less true contact area and vice versa, and this is a 1 to 1 relationship so that ... the effective friction between two surfaces does not depend on the area, only the force between the two!

Formula for Friction: F=μN

Friction does not depend on area, only a coefficient μ (depends on materials) and the force (N) pushing one into the other. That's hard to mentally digest but it's true.

In bike world, that's the force of gravity pushing the road up and the mass of the bike pushing down, times some rubber compound vs asphalt coefficient.
(Soft tires have a higher coefficient than hard tires, and warm tires higher than cold tires.)

In a leaned over bike at speed, there is less perpendicular force pushing all the irregularities of the rubber into the irregularities of the road surface and more shear force pushing it sideways as opposed to a bike sitting completely upright and level moving in a straight line. At speed and at 45 degrees, half of the weight is applied downwards and the other half sideways via centrifugal force.

The net effect is there is less traction available when leaned over for braking and acceleration. Riders hang off because it keeps the bike more perpendicular through the turn and maximizes traction, this allows them to trail brake further into the turn and get on the throttle sooner after the apex.

It is applicable to any bike with any tires, from tiny scooters to giant HD, because the physics of friction don't change. For racers it translates to more speed around turns and for us regular mortals it translates to more traction for slowing, changing direction or even emergency braking in a turn. (Who says you can't brake in a turn? You can. Hang off and try it.)

What it looks like Doohan is doing is putting more of his body weight perpendicular to gravity to increase the downward force on the contact patch through the turn. Whether this works better than having the bike more upright depends on the weight of the rider vs the bike, and if he is making any throttle/brake changes that would affect his traction. (Hard to tell from a still photo.)
 

GregC

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The net effect is there is less traction available when leaned over for braking and acceleration. Riders hang off because it keeps the bike more perpendicular through the turn and maximizes traction, this allows them to trail brake further into the turn and get on the throttle sooner after the apex.
This is how I understood it works and how reference books (eg Total Control) explain it. And why I try to do it this way.


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rpvanoyen

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I would not want him in front of me, crazy fool to himself and others. Cornering is totally wrong, no overview and no pre-defined riding line. I guess he doesn't even have a driving license.
On the other hand, it's exactly what I'm used to see with French motorcyclists... :rolleyes:
 

peergum

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On the other hand, it's exactly what I'm used to see with French motorcyclists... :rolleyes:
A bit prejudicial I think. I'm French and don't ride like that. This is just a stupid guy thinking he's in a race, when he's on a common road - possibly even a bad one as are many small roads in the south of France - with lots of other users on it. He's an ***. All countries carry this kind of assholes, this is not typically/exclusively French.
 
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