Ride Technique VS Fuel Economy

[12NC700X]

I posted in the "Join Fuelly" thread about my initial experiences with the NC and fuel economy, but I wanted to post here to try to get some ideas about how to ride for fuel economy.

So, a bit about the bike. I picked up a used 2012 with 1315 miles. It has a very large set of square side cases. The top box is also the biggest I have ever seen and its elevated a bit to clear the enormous side cases. I'm not a fan, changes ARE coming. It also has the larger Honda windscreen and I think all of this may add a bit of drag. On my ride there was also a bit of a head wind, maybe 10mph consistently.

Now a bit about me. I'm ham fisted, what can I say? But I do know how to ride and get good gas mileage. I recently had a Raider and always got better than the numbers posted by Yamaha and other Raider riders, 52MPG on average but occassionally higher (if I really worked at it like I did today). That said, I bought this bike hoping to achieve some of the numbers I have seen.

Now lets talk about road conditions and ride technique on this trip. I road from Dallas to Houston but took the long way down I-35 (interstate), 77 , 6 (both 4 lane) and 1488, 359, 1093 (all 2 lane). All smooth roads with Speed limits ranging from 30 mph for a brief time in the small towns to 75 mph on the 4 lanes and Interstate. No traffic any where other than the occasional red light in the small towns. Every stop/start, I short shifted like CRAZY. ALL shifts were between 2-3k rpms which means I am in top gear around 50-55mph (or even before most times). Never once did I exceed 3k rpms while accelerating. Once I achieved top gear I rolled on slowly to the speed limit and set my cruise control. I never once exceeded 4k rpms.

The first fuel stop I averaged 45.99 mpg I spent about 10 minutes in a neighborhood but most of the riding was interstate with speeds of 65-75mph. Mostly held it around 70.

The second fuel stop I averaged 54 mpg with more of the same, but at overall slower speeds on 4 lanes roads. Short shifting like mad, never getting above 4k rpms. Most of this leg was spent around the 60 mph range on average. At every red light I pulled in the clutch and coasted to a stop (no revving or down shifts) and a couple of times I actually turned the bike off while stopped at red lights.

The 3rd stop will be sometime tomorrow and I know its going to suck because I was closer to Houston and home. Everyone in Houston drives like they have a terminal illness and after dark you're just a target. So my speeds, acceleration, everything, was like I meant it. Shifts were hard to 5k rpms, freeway speeds were 80mph. I bet I get below 30mpg on this leg.

Now then, that said, knowing the way I rode on the 1st and 2nd leg of my trip (because I honestly don't think I could have ridden any smoother or consistently. In fact I'll be glad to challenge ANYONE in the Houston area to a ride off but it has to be face to face, no fuelly only numbers, sorry), leads me to a few of observations about the numbers I am seeing on fuelly; (SARCASM ALERT!!!) 1.) The numbers are suspect 2.) Some people practice voodoo or dark magic 3.) Everyone rides below 70mph and accelerates like driving miss daisy making my short shift attempts look like childs play. 0-60mph in the 60 second plus range.


I may take some video tomorrow so you guys can see exactly what I am talking about with my shifting and acceleration. I swear to god if I rode my Raider like I rode the NC today I would have gotten close to 60mpg or better. Same for my DRZ400SM, not the 50mpg I saw on the NC. What gives? Advice? Questions? If anyone could share ride technique or tricks. It would be greatly appreciated.

 

[Chestnut]

I ride freeways a huge percentage of the time and have an overall average of about 65mpg. That's over 21,000 miles. When I put on side bags I get 55-60mpg (still freeways, running 75mph+). Try taking off the luggage, but also try not trying so hard. I rarely shift before 4,000rpm and am definitely not easy on the throttle. Places to go, cages to avoid being run over by. Maybe you got a dud, but I expect you'll see the numbers improve.

 

[MZ5]

If you have monstrous saddlebags, those are the primary culprit. The slim Honda saddlebags have very little negative impact, but they may have a little.

The Honda Touring windscreen actually _improves_ my mpg slightly.

Headwinds hurt.

Factory-specified (in the owner's manual) shift points are:
12 mph,
19,
25,
31, And
37 mph

I do not see a particular difference between shifting at those points vs letting the motor reach ~3,000 rpm prior to shifting up, but I haven't tried that hard to really compare.

Speeds over 70 - 75mph, depending, hurt. I ride pretty steady-state at around an indicated 72, and on my bike that doesn't hurt mpg vs lower speeds SO LONG AS I have no head wind.

Your bike may be one of the half dozen that Honda made and gave to all the magazines to test. I don't think I've seen a review yet where an NCX achieved within 15 mpg of what I get every single tank.

Hope you get some thing sorted!

 

[Gonepaddling]

Interesting topic as I am just about to add 2 aluminum side cases.
Fuelly has me averaging 79.8 miles per gallon over the past 2200 miles.
I'm like you and shift around 3000 rpm.
The only thing I have added is one of Dales skid guards.
Best mileage came from highway driving at around 115km/hour to 125.. About 75 miles/hour.
I do have to admit to being only 5foot 3... So I don't create a lot of extra wind resistance.
Most of the rest has been done on rural to urban roads... All with few stops.
I will be interested in seeing the difference.
I seem to remember reading that the larger windscreens have a big impact on mileage.

 

[Gonepaddling]

Ps... If it makes you feel any better... My cost per gallon of gas appears to be $5.16 Canadian.
You guys seem to be at closer to $3....

 

[dduelin]

Nice 5th post, implying that the mileage figures posted for the last 18 months are all a pack of lies or achieved by pussies riding 45 mph.

Welcome.

Interstate mileage can be hugely affected by headwind. It doesn't take much to drive the figures down significantly. My worst mileages bucking a headwind aren't far off your 45-55. Assuming that your speedo is accurate, the bike is fueling properly, and you don't weigh 350 lbs I am confident your mileage will improve and you won't have to ride 35 to 45 mph to do that.

 

[670cc]

Advice? Your attitude is a bit poor for someone supposedly asking for help. "The numbers are suspect" comment, in particular. Ya, sure, and I scratch the 32 off my jeans label and make it a 31 (Seinfeld joke reference). Why would I stoop so low as to lie about my fuel economy?

Anyway, there's is much talk here about short shifting and low RPM, but no mention of throttle opening. I tend to use very little throttle, using only what's needed to get the results I need. Short shifting, but with lots of throttle, may do you more harm than good.

Previous discussions here indicate that speed and wind resistance has a huge efficiency effect. The luggage may be a factor in your case. As for the windscreen, some riders, me included, saw a mileage improvement when a larger than stock windscreen was installed.

Yes, I do ride below 70 mph. Do you see a problem with that? I did that and averaged 76 mpg on a 600 mile Interstate day from Illinois to North Carolina. Reference my Fuelly entries 19, 20, and 21.

Greg

 

[SergeantChuck]

That is actually kind of funny. 256 people on several different continents and Fuelly reports an average for all of those bikes is 64mpg. I guess if every single person was fudging it a little bit. I carry a pen and paper in my frunk and right it down so I can input it when I get home but I'm sure some put it in immediately on their phone.

It seems I have a fairly close setup to what you have although my panniers are not large squares. I ride will all the OEM panniers and trunk attached constantly. I do not ride without them. I had the Honda Touring and went to a similar sized Puig windscreen. My ride is approx 60 miles a day to work and back. Half is wooded back roads and that other half is Interstate through Little Rock, AR. The speed limit is 70mph on the Interstate so I do at least that up to 75mph. A little higher if passing a semi. Winds are always blowing in Arkansas. I have to deal with good strong gusty winds constantly. The back roads I cruise at 55mph. Only a couple stops.

I ride pretty aggressive. I don't focus on the fuel economy because it is already so good I don't care about a couple mpg plus my primary vehicle outside the bike is a highly modified jeep that gets 14mpg. I would be happy to get 50mpg.

May last ten tanks are hanging around 68mpg. And I don't fudge the numbers.

I will say that there are several people on Fuelly that are only averaging in the mid to upper 50's. I could explain why unless a guy was riding 75mph or higher for a very extended period of time. Wind drag plays a huge factor.

 

[Beemerphile]

I once beat 80 mpg on the Blue Ridge Parkway at 50 mph sustained, but I can't MAKE mine get under 60 mpg. Lord knows I have tried. Average is 65mpg shifting between 4-5000 rpm and wearing tires out like crazy. I would think that in general the type of person who participates in Fuelly is the type of person that drives for mileage running the averages up, but my average is about the Fuelly average so maybe that is not the case.

 

[estarr]

You are brave turning your bike of at stop lights. I don't even put my bike in neutral for the most part. But I'm always looking out for the people who want to rear end me.

 

[Naked_Duc]

I doubt all 260 NCX owners are practicing voodoo magic or riding like Driving Miss Daisy. Under normal riding condition and with reasonable riding habits, it's really quite easy to get your MPG higher than 60. It's just the matter of whether you are willing to do it, considering how big of a ham fister you are.

Take off your huge hard box and you will instantly see improvement. The large Honda wind screen actually helps your MPG by creating an air bubble around the riding and smooth out the airstream.

SLOW DOWN. Going 75+ is killing your MPG. Lowering your cruising speed by 5-10 and you will see 5-10% improvement in MPG. I know it's difficult in Houston Texas when the roads are wide and straight and everybody is going balls out.

Lower your RPM and go easy on the throttle. HOW DARE YOU! THAT'S HOW MY DAUGHTER RIDES!!! Newton's law of motion is, well, the law. Force = mass * acceleration. the harder you accelerate, the more force you would need and that burns more fuel. Simple as that. Also, the rider size might add to the equation. Obviously if you are 6'8, 350, no matter what you do on the bike, your MPG is going to suck.

Hope that helps

 

[Gigs]

I have always ridden my NC with all three honda luggage pieces and the Honda screen (came that way from the dealer). I had to ride 150miles at like 80 to get my mpg's to touch sixty. I ride 52 miles round trip to work 5 days a week and average mid 70's mpg. I have a little town and 2 lane back roads. No traffic in the morning, but on the way home it's stop and go and me sweating (I live in SC).
I think it's all about your right wrist. I use hardly any throttle and engine brake a lot. Unless it's an emergency or I'm on the interstate I hardly ever rev above 3500rpm. It seems rapid acceleration and >75mph is what kills efficiency.


Gigs

 

[Chris]

Riding 2 up on the highway at speeds between 130 and 155kph (80 to 90 mph roughly) I get about 23 km to the litre - about 54 mpg US. On the back roads, varying between about 60kph and 110 kph (40 to 70 mph) rises to about 28 km per litre or 66 mpg. I accelerate hard and I'm fairly heavy - about 110kgs/240 pounds. My pillion passengers are either my wife or daughter, they're fairly light but combined load is well over 350 lbs. I ride with the Honda top box and a Puig screen, occasionally with side panniers too. The first couple of tanks full of fuel returned poorer mileage - the engine needs to loosen up a bit to start to be economical. The bike's now got about 4,500 km/3,000 miles on and the fuel consumption is fairly consistent. These seem pretty reasonable consumption figures to me - I'm not overly interested in the fuel consumption but being able to go about 280 km between fills and still have a reasonable amount of fuel in reserve is good. Not quite the 800km I get from a tank of diesel in the car but I don't get quite the same fatigue factor stuck in the seat of the car that I get on the bike either. I haven't bothered registering on fuelly but I do calculate my consumption every time I fill up - just a compulsive doer of mental arithmetic.

I'd be more inclined to think you were faking 30 mpg than the other riders are faking 60+ There's not much to go wrong on modern engines to mess up fuel consumption these days but if you don't start to get reasonable mileage in the next few tanks' full then maybe something is off on your machine. The last time I saw 30mpg on a bike I was riding a Suzuki GT550 two stroke, one of the smoothest engines I remember with power and torque similar to the NC - but a piston ported 1970's two stroke with awful efficiency.

 

[12NC700X]

Thanks for all of the replies. Yep, I doubt very seriously that all 260 people on fuelly are lying. Sarcasm doesn't come across well in text, I should have put something to let you know it was a sarcastic comment. I took it out today and rode with some friends and just decided to let it all hang out like I rode my DRZ. Surprisingly on one fill up I got 61.1MPG, a fill up where I was certain I was going to get <40mpg. So it's a move in the right direction. Like I said, yesterday I was very focused on posting some ridiculous fuel econ numbers. My short shifting was not "alot" of throttle and shifting early, it was an off idle roll with grandma in the minivan behind tailgating and honking (not really, but it certainly wasn't a dragstip launch or even my regular launch.) So my conclusion is that I will need to figure out HOW to ride this thing because the technique that worked on ALL of my previous (recent) motorcycles seems to have absolutely no bearing on how I ride the NC. Apparently, wack the throttle and shift late(r) works better than "Driving Miss Daisy". 2 fill ups today saw 61.1 and 53 MPG (full luggage, 60-80mph on interstae and backroads). My overall average has climbed to 54.9 MPG. At least now I am on the fuelly boards.

 

[12NC700X]

I ride freeways a huge percentage of the time and have an overall average of about 65mpg. That's over 21,000 miles. When I put on side bags I get 55-60mpg (still freeways, running 75mph+). Try taking off the luggage, but also try not trying so hard. I rarely shift before 4,000rpm and am definitely not easy on the throttle. Places to go, cages to avoid being run over by. Maybe you got a dud, but I expect you'll see the numbers improve.

Thanks Chestnut, best advice I got. I just rode the crap out of it today and saw much better numbers.

 

[12NC700X]

Nice 5th post, implying that the mileage figures posted for the last 18 months are all a pack of lies or achieved by pussies riding 45 mph.

Welcome.

Sorry. It was meant as sarcasm, not as an insult. I see you have an ST1300, had an '04 myself that I put 48k miles on. What year? Color? I miss my ol' ST.

 

[12NC700X]

You are brave turning your bike of at stop lights. I don't even put my bike in neutral for the most part. But I'm always looking out for the people who want to rear end me.

Not something I have ever done before and certainly wouldn't do it in Houston city limits, but I tried it yesterday in a bunch of little towns. Like you, I constantly check my 6. You never know when some "texter" will plow through the light at 60mph.

 

[max cooper]

I don't short shift to the extreme. I feel that any engine other than a John Deere should be run at an RPM that makes the engine feel comfortable and responsive to the riders throttle input. To intentionally lug an engine is making it work much harder and suffer more stress than allowing it to breath as it was designed to. I have always shifted my 700X at 4k to 5k and run steady at say 3200 to 4000 rpm buzzing down the road. My 700x feels smoother and happier running in that range all day. I pick the speed I want to travel at, and choose whatever gear makes the engine happy. I will confess, I don't ride steady at 75 + mph often. But I don't baby the throttle when accelerating. What's the fun in that ? Anyway, I have yet to get under 70 mpg except when the bike was brand spanking new and the engine was still tight. Most of the time I get an honest 74 mpg. Maybe I just got a good one. So that's my 2 cents worth .

 

[killerbeezer]

I average 64mpg. I have the Givi Trekker 33 side bags and I'm 250lbs. I usually shift at or before 4K rpm. My practice is to take a picture of the pump and the miles and enter into fuelly later that day. So far I've accounted for every mile on the bike.

 

[Old Can Ride]

You are doing great. Have the same setup, but have the Givi Trekker trunk also. I get about 58 mpg. But from time to time I do see 65 mpg.