Recommended Chain,Sprocket, and Costs

[Larryb]

Great info

 

[MZ5]

Strat, if you want to put the new chain on yourself, and don't have a rivet tool, you can buy a clip-type master link instead. Unless you have your chain vendor cut it to length for you, though, you'll also need a chain breaker ($10 - 25 from a farm-supply store, or probably other places, too).

 

[StratTuner]

Strat, if you want to put the new chain on yourself, and don't have a rivet tool, you can buy a clip-type master link instead. Unless you have your chain vendor cut it to length for you, though, you'll also need a chain breaker ($10 - 25 from a farm-supply store, or probably other places, too).

Wow... never used either of those, so it's off to the local mechanic. I get the idea as I've repaired bicycle chains on the road during an event, but a MC chain has to be a little tougher.

I do have the 1/2" drive torque wrench for the back wheel. I use it to loosen the back wheel when adjusting the chain tension.

 

[StratTuner]

Great info

Yeah, I get that feeling a lot around here. The good people on this board make owning an NC easier and a lot more fun!

 

[SergeantChuck]

Yeah, I get that feeling a lot around here. The good people on this board make owning an NC easier and a lot more fun!

I agree. I'm a member of a major jeep wrangler board and it gets out of hand constanly. Even the owner/member contributes. Its got to the point I don't go there much anymore. This board is much more civil and helpful.

 

[bamamate]

A couple of things Strat,

Generally it is not recommended to use a torque wrench for removing bolts/nuts. You can damage it and/or get it out of spec by applying too much pressure to loosen a bolt/nut. Pickup an inexpensive breaker bar to do that. If you have no choice and it is a clicker type torque wrench, set it to the max torque setting before using it to remove. On the bar/pointer style wrenches don't take it past the max rating and I have no idea on the electronic ones as I've never used one of those fancy ones.

Something to consider, sprocket Center has a rivet tool for $75. Figure 1-2 chain changes and you will probably have paid for it over paying someone....just a thought.

Motion Pro PBR Chain Breaker & Riveting Tool Kit - Tools & Maintenance

 

[Beemerphile]

Something to consider, sprocket Center has a rivet tool for $75. Figure 1-2 chain changes and you will probably have paid for it over paying someone....just a thought.

Motion Pro PBR Chain Breaker & Riveting Tool Kit - Tools & Maintenance

Please remember that there are two type of rivets: solid pin and hollow pin. Make sure that the type of tool you get will rivet the type of master link you have.

 

[L.B.S.]

Something to consider, sprocket Center has a rivet tool for $75. Figure 1-2 chain changes and you will probably have paid for it over paying someone....just a thought.

When I did my last new chain install, (different bike than NCX) my rivet "tool" was a giant C-clamp, duct tape, and an old shifter detent lock out ball bearing from the High/Low/Low 4X4 transfer case in my Samurai.

I can hear Lee's hair standing on end from all the way across the continent, hee hee hee

 

[bamamate]

Please remember that there are two type of rivets: solid pin and hollow pin. Make sure that the type of tool you get will rivet the type of master link you have.

Thanks for that reminder. I posted that one because it works with hollow nose & soft nose rivets which I took soft nose to be the same as solid pin. Is that the same?

 

[anglachel]

Something to consider, sprocket Center has a rivet tool for $75. Figure 1-2 chain changes and you will probably have paid for it over paying someone....just a thought.

That's generally the bar I set for doing my own work, if I can buy the tools, and understand how to use them, cheaper then I can have the job done once.

Of course the flip side of that is that I don't buy cheap tools...
partially because my father was a mechanic for 30 years, and I was spoiled as a kid using professional grade tools all the time... (it did have it's set back at times as he worked mostly on semi trucks and some tools were a little over kill on my ford ranger... though on the flip side the tool he had for drum brakes on tractor trailers gave so much leverage on the ranger that the springs gave practically no resistance at all..)
partially because I can't stand breaking tools midway through a job...
partially because I find that it costs more to buy the expensive one the second time around then just to buy quality the first time around...

All that being said, I can count dozens of jobs where I spent a fair amount of money on tools, to save a couple hundred bucks... and I have very few tools that I've only used once, actually most of the tools I've only used once are all in the same tool box for the bicycle... and I have a few that I've not had the chance to use yet for the motorcycle (most suggested here at one point or another and purchased to get free shipping on an amazon order, but they'll get used soon enough)

 

[Beemerphile]

Thanks for that reminder. I posted that one because it works with hollow nose & soft nose rivets which I took soft nose to be the same as solid pin. Is that the same?

Well no, they are not the same, but I probably mis-spoke it. This is an example of a tool that can only be used for hollow rivets...

Amazon.com: Motion Pro 08-0058 Chain Breaker and Riveting Tool: Automotive

The tool you referenced will do hollow or soft pins (which I was calling "solid" pins). Not all tools have the dies to do both. Soft nose and hollow rivets use different dies. This is what you get if you try to stake a solid (soft) rivet with a hollow pin die...



Notice they are staked off-center and the right hand pin is cracked. The hollow pin die needs the hollow pin to center it and it will only deform a hollow pin sufficiently to properly attach it. You will break the tool before you deform the soft pin enough to hold it on. Wrong tool for a soft tip pin. Here is what it looks like when used to stake the correct hollow pin...



Make sure you have the right tool for the particular pin. Now, there is another solid pin that is a hardened pin. It does not use staking to hold the sideplate on, but rather interference between the OD of the hardened pin and the ID of the sideplate holes. I don't know of any motorcycle drive chains that use hardened solid pins. So when I said "solid" pins, I meant "soft nose" not "hardened" pins. Sorry if I confused things.

The other important installation point is to properly space the sideplates before staking the pins. Some master links come with spacers to place over the o-rings to assure that you do not press the sideplate in too far. Some do not have the spacers and expect you to measure that the sideplates of your master link are the same width as the adjacent links. I have kept some spacers to use if the master link does not come with them.

 

[L.B.S.]

All tomfoolery on my part aside, Lee- thanks for your continual great posts, it's very much appreciated that you take the time to share

 

[StratTuner]

Please remember that there are two type of rivets: solid pin and hollow pin. Make sure that the type of tool you get will rivet the type of master link you have.

that means I should probably order the chain and sprockets set and then see what master link they send with the chain. I presume the manufacturer will send a master link with the chain? Bicycle chains come with one.

I have the service manual and will look at it today to see what things you have to remove to get at the sprockets. It's all new, and the moment I dread is that moment when I realize that I have to disassemble something I didn't think I'd have to touch.

Then there's the joyful experience of putting it all back together and realizing it doesn't feel "right". (stomach turns just thinking about it.)

I'm waiting for email from the local mechanic about doing the install.

 

[L.B.S.]

that means I should probably order the chain and sprockets set and then see what master link they send with the chain. I presume the manufacturer will send a master link with the chain?

The VX2 chain you listed as a purchase choice, comes with a master link. Probably the soft nose Rivet type I'm pretty sure.

Also available separately, are individual Clip style master links for the same chain:

Motorcycle chain rivet link

And the soft nose Rivet type:

Motorcycle chain rivet link

 

[bamamate]

Are there advantages/disadvantages to clip vs hollow rivet vs soft nose rivet or is more of a personal preference?

 

[L.B.S.]

Are there advantages/disadvantages to clip vs hollow rivet vs soft nose rivet or is more of a personal preference?

I think 99 guys out of 100 would have a preference for the Rivet style.

In truth I do think they are probably less prone to failure if installed correctly, and granted, most likely are superior. The Clip style might be more easily affixed improperly, or less gracious to a not perfect job.

Having said that, of course I will be contrary, and say that I like the Clip style, lol. My view should be taken with a healthy grain of salt though, as it was coloured many years ago and kind of set the mold, so to speak. The only chain failure I've ever had in all my life, was of a Rivet style link, and it was done by a Dealership Pro mechanic. It did me a world of hurt, and stranded me in the middle of nowhere Northern BC, to boot.

All the Clip type master links I've installed myself since I was 16, ridden a gazillion miles on, and road raced with, have been 100% faithful for over 40+ years.

So. Any of the "but Rivets are better!" arguments will kinda deflect off my stubborn armour, until I ever have a Clip kind that I install myself fail on me.

I imagine more people will have stories about how their Clip style master failed on them, but never a Rivet type, so it's perspective and odds, I guess. (much like plugging flat tires, versus disposing of for new...)

 

[ron700]

FYI...........The Motion Pro PBR tool (for both soft and hard rivets) # 08-0470 is available on eBay for $65 - which I think is a great price. Will do up to #530 chain IIRC.

 

[duk2n]

My view is similar. Until the NC700X, my bikes have been using clip links, and my old XT350 still uses it. Never had a failure.

I would add it is way easy to do a good job installing a clip link than a riveted one. Now, will a clip link handle the torque of the NCX engine?

I think 99 guys out of 100 would have a preference for the Rivet style.

In truth I do think they are probably less prone to failure if installed correctly, and granted, most likely are superior. The Clip style might be more easily affixed improperly, or less gracious to a not perfect job.

Having said that, of course I will be contrary, and say that I like the Clip style, lol. My view should be taken with a healthy grain of salt though, as it was coloured many years ago and kind of set the mold, so to speak. The only chain failure I've ever had in all my life, was of a Rivet style link, and it was done by a Dealership Pro mechanic. It did me a world of hurt, and stranded me in the middle of nowhere Northern BC, to boot.

All the Clip type master links I've installed myself since I was 16, ridden a gazillion miles on, and road raced with, have been 100% faithful for over 40+ years.

So. Any of the "but Rivets are better!" arguments will kinda deflect off my stubborn armour, until I ever have a Clip kind that I install myself fail on me.

I imagine more people will have stories about how their Clip style master failed on them, but never a Rivet type, so it's perspective and odds, I guess. (much like plugging flat tires, versus disposing of for new...)

 

[dduelin]

This is an idea I saw somewhere that seemed had merit so I did it when I changed chains. If you use a gray or black chain then use a gold master link if you rivet it and vice versa for gold chains. A contrasting color link gives a easily seen start/stop point for cleaning and lubing.

Cycle Gear has a very serviceable Stockton chain breaker/riveting tool for about $30 when on sale. Normally about $80.

 

[Beemerphile]

You get to decide if you think they know anything or not, but D.I.D. suggests that their own loose fit clip links are 65% as strong as the chains and the ZJ rivet links are 100% as strong as the chains. Further, they recommend that if your motorcycle came with an endless chain, that only rivet style connecting links should be used. It is clear they do not see the clip style links as equivalent - even though they manufacture and sell clip style links. They consider them adequate for lower displacement off-road motorcycles.

http://www.didchain.com/PDF/DID_2013usa_final.pdf

I also read that...

"...D.I.D® strongly recommends ZJ Rivet Type Master Link for all the chains in the D.I.D® drive chain line up that have both ZJ Rivet Type Master Link and FJ/RJ Clip Type one.

As far as what style rivet link (soft nose, hollow pin, etc.) it is most important that the link is recommended by the manufacturer for the specific model of chain that you are using. I am using an ERV3 rivet master on the ERV3 chain. You certainly wouldn't want to use an RK master link on a DID chain, or vice versa. There are differences in pin sizes and link thicknesses that could make this dangerous. Don't think in terms of whether a hollw pin is better or worse than a soft nose pin. Select the chain you want, and get the master link that is made to work with it. Easy Peasy.