Drive chain maintenance

[670cc]

I verified the swingarm marks using the alignment tool. They were stamped correctly on my NC. I use the marks only now. I guess some marks on some bike somewhere have been wrong (not necessarily an NC), so verifying them is advised.

 

[hojo]

To be honest, I don't look at the alignment marks that closely, I loosen the chain guard and put on that alignment tool. Once you have one in your hand and put it on the chain, you can see how easy it is to make sure the wheel is straight. I loosen the alignment tool and rotate the wheel some and then tighten the alignment tool again to verify the wheel is on straight.

 

[Therapy]

Someone said you can just use a straight edge or a square? How is that done?

 

[Old Can Ride]

When on the road, all those fancy tools setting at home are useless. Just pull out a knife and count the number of threads on each side. The main thing is to lube the chain more often when on the road. Most of us, check the chain less often when on the road. Seldem needs adjusting, but always needs more lube.

 

[MiG Angel]

I verified the swingarm marks using the alignment tool. They were stamped correctly on my NC. I use the marks only now. I guess some marks on some bike somewhere have been wrong (not necessarily an NC), so verifying them is advised.

I use the marks but measure them using my calipers. I also use the calipers to measure the tension by setting them at 35mm and adjusting the chain accordingly.

 

[hojo]

When on the road, all those fancy tools setting at home are useless. Just pull out a knife and count the number of threads on each side. The main thing is to lube the chain more often when on the road. Most of us, check the chain less often when on the road. Seldem needs adjusting, but always needs more lube.

That "fancy" tool I use to check the chain alignments sits in my frunk, at home or on the road.

 

[MZ5]

The reason to not trust the marks (nor number of threads sticking out on the adjuster bolts) is not merely whether they're made precisely right and the same as one another. It is also that there is error introduced if/when the swingarm is not built precisely straight and square, and the same for its mounting point on the frame. All those errors are cumulative, and make the obvious and only reasonable way to measure chain alignment (actually sprocket alignment), a straight edge. The Motion Pro tool is very handy and compact, and is a straight edge that will simply and easily align over the top of the chain.

 

[670cc]

The reason to not trust the marks (nor number of threads sticking out on the adjuster bolts) is not merely whether they're made precisely right and the same as one another. It is also that there is error introduced if/when the swingarm is not built precisely straight and square, and the same for its mounting point on the frame. All those errors are cumulative, and make the obvious and only reasonable way to measure chain alignment (actually sprocket alignment), a straight edge. The Motion Pro tool is very handy and compact, and is a straight edge that will simply and easily align over the top of the chain.

All that is true, but if we want to get detailed about ensuring the frame and swingarm are well made, you need to also take into account wheel alignment. The same adjustment that aligns the sprockets also aligns the wheels. I guess in an extremely bad case, a compromise between good sprocket alignment and good wheel alignment might be needed, but I doubt things are that bad with our Hondas.

 

[davidc83]

The reason to not trust the marks (nor number of threads sticking out on the adjuster bolts) is not merely whether they're made precisely right and the same as one another. It is also that there is error introduced if/when the swingarm is not built precisely straight and square, and the same for its mounting point on the frame. All those errors are cumulative, and make the obvious and only reasonable way to measure chain alignment (actually sprocket alignment), a straight edge. The Motion Pro tool is very handy and compact, and is a straight edge that will simply and easily align over the top of the chain.

The service manual (the one we buy and use for maintenance) specifically states to use the marks on the side of the swing arms. Another case if we are not going to follow the written directions in the service manual, why buy the manual??

 

[L.B.S.]

I personally think it's simply a matter of individual choice as to how precise they want to get. For some (me) most things are "meh, close enough" and I don't get overly antsy about "the letter of the law". I'm more a "spirit of the law" kinda guy lol I can hear and feel if my chain is off kilter, or how too tight/not tight enough the rear axle nut is, with a quick spin of the rear wheel, etc. I do not use torque wrenches for anything other than very specific engine rebuilding procedures.

Others, want the exact psi, the exact mm distance left/right/front/rear, or use torque wrenches on fairing bolts etc., and more power to them. I don't think either side should be too hard on the other viewpoint, even if they don't quite agree with it.

 

[davidc83]

I personally think it's simply a matter of individual choice as to how precise they want to get. For some (me) most things are "meh, close enough" and I don't get overly antsy about "the letter of the law". I'm more a "spirit of the law" kinda guy lol I can hear and feel if my chain is off kilter, or how too tight/not tight enough the rear axle nut is, with a quick spin of the rear wheel, etc. I do not use torque wrenches for anything other than very specific engine rebuilding procedures.

Others, want the exact psi, the exact mm distance left/right/front/rear, or use torque wrenches on fairing bolts etc., and more power to them. I don't think either side should be too hard on the other viewpoint, even if they don't quite agree with it.

Amen! Never used a torque wrench until my wife bought me one this past xmas (I am closer to 60 than 50); and I have only used it twice (tightening the rear wheel) and even set on the correct setting-I didn't feel confident it tightened enough so I used my socket wrench-now the thing is more of a paper weight.

 

[L.B.S.]

I hasten to add my viewpoints can be all wet, and I don't council or encourage anyone else to do shoddy work or not follow expressly written professional methods and procedures as listed in Shop Manuals, or approved mechanic's recommendations.

I wouldn't want to be the cause of some poor sod having a real bad day, due to following my sketchy advice, lol. It can be tough to state your thoughts on the 'net, and end up doing more harm than good, when that was the last thing you wanted to do...

And I *really* don't mean to belittle or kick sand in the faces of the pros who do actually do things by the book as they are supposed to be done. I would be definitely remorseful if someone like Lee (beemerphile) thought I was being a doofus towards him and his way of doing things.

Just wanted to make that clear.

 

[Therapy]

The thing about torque wrenches is experience.
I tell my kids to use a torque wrench and then loosen the fastener to feel it. Then tighten it and check it.
I explain they need to know what the materials are. Steel bolt in aluminum? Steel in steel? Steel screw in steel threads through plastic panels?
Some awareness is needed also.
A bit of experience and one can be pretty confident of being pretty darn close.
PS - I almost never use a torque wrench these days for most things.

 

[Fuzzy]

The thing about torque wrenches is experience.
I tell my kids to use a torque wrench and then loosen the fastener to feel it. Then tighten it and check it.
I explain they need to know what the materials are. Steel bolt in aluminum? Steel in steel? Steel screw in steel threads through plastic panels?
Some awareness is needed also.
A bit of experience and one can be pretty confident of being pretty darn close.
PS - I almost never use a torque wrench these days for most things.

I have known many who thought they could get close to a torque wrench but in verifiable test have never seen any experienced mechanic get close. If you can you are a uniquely talented individual.

 

[MZ5]

Another case if we are not going to follow the written directions in the service manual, why buy the manual??

Because it would be foolish to ignore the wealth of information throughout the whole manual simply because there is a better way to accomplish any one thing in it?

 

[Therapy]

I have known many who thought they could get close to a torque wrench but in verifiable test have never seen any experienced mechanic get close. If you can you are a uniquely talented individual.

Interesting.
I will have to test myself......again.

Remind me of the latest studies on Laryngeal pressure before intubation to prevent gastric reflux and aspiration. The required amount of pressure to prevent it without potential damage was achievable by only a small percentage of experienced staff.
Whelp........now what?

PS what new "clicking" type of torque wrench should I buy - No Snap-On quality (price) mind you. My old long arm "bendy bar" one is silly.

 

[670cc]

In my line of professional work, certain critical tasks require torque wrench use - no if, and, but, or guessing. It's just as bad to over tighten as to under tighten. (Given a chance, my guess is more people will probably over torque than under - good 'n tight, right?). I figure the safety aspect of my motorcycle is just as important as the machines I service, so all critical fasteners like brake calipers, axle nuts, and engine bolts WILL see a torque wrench. I treat it as mandatory, just like helmet use.

A warning to all with "calibrated" wrists: the NC700 cylinder head cover bolts require much less torque than you might think.

 

[itlives]

Interesting.
I will have to test myself......again.

Remind me of the latest studies on Laryngeal pressure before intubation to prevent gastric reflux and aspiration.
Whelp........now what?

I once pulled my hyoid (sp) bone. Didn't even know I had one. It took a lot of pressure to do that.

 

[bamamate]

A warning to all with "calibrated" wrists: the NC700 cylinder head cover bolts require much less torque than you might think.

+1 I snapped one

 

[670cc]

+1 I snapped one

That's OK, but if you snapped two off then there's no hope for ya.