Who doesn't like the DCT and why?

[mike5100]

There's a guy on the english forum who really doesn't like the DCT (I do by the way). His problem was that it stalled on him at low speed in a car park on a VFR1200 DCT. Also he prefers the full engagement he gets with a manual box as another poster has referred to above.
Mike

 

[Fred]

As a woods rider on conventional dual sport bikes who uses the clutch to modulate traction in uncertain terrain a lot, I find the DCT engages from a stop with almost identical precision as clutch release on a dual sport bike once you learn the technique....which is the most amazing thing about this technology, and also the down shift engine braking is superb, once again after you master the combination of releasing throttle, manually engaging lower gear, or the discrete use of either you can whip through the twisties in very rapid fashion without a lot of brake use. (I better get off this thread as I find it really difficult to fault the DCT, and seriously I am looking for cracks in the armor of this beast every time I ride it!) See you on another thread.

 

[johnakay]

There's a guy on the english forum who really doesn't like the DCT (I do by the way). His problem was that it stalled on him at low speed in a car park on a VFR1200 DCT. Also he prefers the full engagement he gets with a manual box as another poster has referred to above.
Mike

its not Rocker66 is it. what a dork.

 

[supertux1]

One aspect I can see being problematic is whisky throttling it during an emergency stop without the clutch in as extra protection against taking off.

With a manual transmission, most people are trained to pull in the clutch, front and rear brakes, and if the throttle is blipped a bit during that, no problem.

I think there's at least one video of someone in a panic on an AT and blipping the throttle while trying to right the bike. (The one where the guy gets his rainsuit caught on the left peg.)

Slow speed maneuvers without a clutch might also be tricky. I have heard that the newer 2016 DCT models have better clutch feathering at lower speeds though so that remains to be seen.

I'm glad I got the DCT though. More focus on what's happening around me, never stalling, not worrying about locking up the rear on bad roads because of a wrong shift etc...

 

[dduelin]

One aspect I can see being problematic is whisky throttling it during an emergency stop without the clutch in as extra protection against taking off.

With a manual transmission, most people are trained to pull in the clutch, front and rear brakes, and if the throttle is blipped a bit during that, no problem.

I think there's at least one video of someone in a panic on an AT and blipping the throttle while trying to right the bike. (The one where the guy gets his rainsuit caught on the left peg.)

Slow speed maneuvers without a clutch might also be tricky. I have heard that the newer 2016 DCT models have better clutch feathering at lower speeds though so that remains to be seen.

I'm glad I got the DCT though. More focus on what's happening around me, never stalling, not worrying about locking up the rear on bad roads because of a wrong shift etc...

One thing you can count on is that someone will screw up no matter how easy something is to do or they can be counted on to tear up an anvil in a sand pit. Even if they have a clutch or not they will hit the thing they are trying to avoid. If they whisky throttle they won't be able to pull in the clutch either.

 

[L.B.S.]

In the theoretical dislike column, what happens on a DCT if it *does* stall?


With my F800ST, it would frequently stall just as I was finished with the clutch, and applying more throttle. It would go *pop* and flame out, locking the rear tire most of the time if in first gear, or at best, just suddenly not having the forward momentum when I was expecting it, causing all manner of cursing and strained muscles. Sometimes it was a legitimate danger.

In those instances, pulling the clutch back in allowed freewheeling and either a clutch in/out restart or a clutch in + thumb to the starter button. If for some odd reason or fueling glitch a DCT stalls, does it automatically default to neutral, or do you have to be quick as a bunny to try and hit the neutral button with your right thumb, and then starter button, or...?

I can't think off hand ever stalling on my NC700, so I'm guessing it's a rare occurrence enough anyway, and probably less so with the DCT's because you are eliminating the human component of a ham fisted clutch release, but I am still curious.

 

[L.B.S.]

One thing you can count on is that someone will screw up no matter how easy something is to do or they can be counted on to tear up an anvil in a sand pit. Even if they have a clutch or not they will hit the thing they are trying to avoid. If they whisky throttle they won't be able to pull in the clutch either.

"Calling upon my years of experience, I froze at the controls."

-Stirling Moss

 

[kpinvt]

It's been really, really hard not to chime in on this thread.

 

[mike5100]

In the theoretical dislike column, what happens on a DCT if it *does* stall?


With my F800ST, it would frequently stall just as I was finished with the clutch, and applying more throttle. It would go *pop* and flame out, locking the rear tire most of the time if in first gear, or at best, just suddenly not having the forward momentum when I was expecting it, causing all manner of cursing and strained muscles. Sometimes it was a legitimate danger.

In those instances, pulling the clutch back in allowed freewheeling and either a clutch in/out restart or a clutch in + thumb to the starter button. If for some odd reason or fueling glitch a DCT stalls, does it automatically default to neutral, or do you have to be quick as a bunny to try and hit the neutral button with your right thumb, and then starter button, or...?

I can't think off hand ever stalling on my NC700, so I'm guessing it's a rare occurrence enough anyway, and probably less so with the DCT's because you are eliminating the human component of a ham fisted clutch release, but I am still curious.

One guy has tried several experiments where he has hit the kill switch while travelling along at speed (You cannot put the bike into neutral when moving). He says each time he has done it the DCT box has gracefully changed down through the gears all the way to 1st as the bike has slowed down. It seems the DCT box will do this as long as it has enough electrical power to do so. I'm not sure what happems if you were to put the ignition off rather than hitting the kill switch. My guess is that it would still change down gracefully.
I have only seen the one report of a DCT bike stalling.
Mike

 

[Doc True]

So I have to admit that I started this thread yesterday because I wasn't sure which tranny to get. I was considering the DCT, but wanted to know the worst before I bought one. I didn't have time to read all of the replies before I test drove and bought my bike today. At any rate, the bad reviews I read were not that damning. After a brief test ride, I bought a Red 2014 DCT, with a sergeant seat (for my staff sergeant ***), and factory sidecases, light bar, and tall windscreen. Only had 1250 miles on it. Needless to say, I didn't think the DCT was too bad.


And just to stay on topic, I don't like the way the engine seems to lug when accelerating in D mode. I makes it feel like a diesel engine for some reason. The shifting is also more cluncky than I anticipated, but my first bike was a 2007 F650GS and it didn't bother me then. I doubt it's going to bother me much now.

 

[Gbjbany]

Great News - Glad we didnt put you off- I bought the bike with dct because its issues are much less than the benefits - Especially if you commute in traffic as i do.

 

[walawn]

So I have to admit that I started this thread yesterday because I wasn't sure which tranny to get. I was considering the DCT, but wanted to know the worst before I bought one. I didn't have time to read all of the replies before I test drove and bought my bike today. At any rate, the bad reviews I read were not that damning. After a brief test ride, I bought a Red 2014 DCT, with a sergeant seat (for my staff sergeant ***), and factory sidecases, light bar, and tall windscreen. Only had 1250 miles on it. Needless to say, I didn't think the DCT was too bad.


And just to stay on topic, I don't like the way the engine seems to lug when accelerating in D mode. I makes it feel like a diesel engine for some reason. The shifting is also more cluncky than I anticipated, but my first bike was a 2007 F650GS and it didn't bother me then. I doubt it's going to bother me much now.

Drive in S mode. Problem solved.

 

[Brillot2000]

Drive in S mode. Problem solved.

I have to agree. "S-Mode" is far better for over 90% of everyday driving requirements.

 

[Brillot2000]

Great News - Glad we didnt put you off- I bought the bike with dct because its issues are much less than the benefits - Especially if you commute in traffic as i do.

I commute to work everyday in the Los Angeles Metro Area. I find that "D-Mode" works fine when you are cruising at a constant or fairly constant speed. I find "MT-Mode" is helpful when lane splitting. Having the bike in a fixed gear is best suited for this type of service. You will also be using both the "+" & "-" paddles constantly.

 

[johnakay]

didn't someone on here upped the front sprocket by 1 tooth and found it much better in 'D' mode and even better in sport mode to?
theres was a post I'm sure,but I'm buggered if I can find it.

 

[davidc83]

So I have to admit that I started this thread yesterday because I wasn't sure which tranny to get. I was considering the DCT, but wanted to know the worst before I bought one. I didn't have time to read all of the replies before I test drove and bought my bike today. At any rate, the bad reviews I read were not that damning. After a brief test ride, I bought a Red 2014 DCT, with a sergeant seat (for my staff sergeant ***), and factory sidecases, light bar, and tall windscreen. Only had 1250 miles on it. Needless to say, I didn't think the DCT was too bad.


And just to stay on topic, I don't like the way the engine seems to lug when accelerating in D mode. I makes it feel like a diesel engine for some reason. The shifting is also more cluncky than I anticipated, but my first bike was a 2007 F650GS and it didn't bother me then. I doubt it's going to bother me much now.

You are going to like your new bike. I had a bmw g650gs (same bike as the 2007 F650gs) and I traded it (got tired of listening to a thumper all day long) in for the Honda NC700X and never regretted it. Even though the NC700 tranny is clunky, not as clunky as the bmw f7650gs; my riding buddy has a 2007 bmw f650gs (he bought new in 2007) and I can hear him shifting 50 yards in front of me-always have...if you got the bike at C&C, I know the guy who traded it in (he traded it in for a new C50T-he likes cruisers more and it goes with his 2015 Honda Goldwing). I tried to trade him out of that Sergent seat before he traded the bike, but I was a week late (I was on vacation when he traded)..

 

[Brillot2000]

2. I was following a rider up a switchback and for some reason he slowed a lot coming out of the corner - so i got close, i had no way to keep revs up to keep me upright whilst slipping the clutch ! _ i had to just go for it and steer away. i missed the other bike by inches but it made me stay much further back - lesson learned.

You are aware the DCT model has ABS, right?

You can slam on the brakes if you have too in situations such as that. I was glad many times that I had the ABS, a few of them was when someone cut right in from of me to make a turn in front of me. I all you have to worry about is where to direct the bike in those situations.

"S-Mode" is best suited for canyon runs. "D-Mode" shouldn't be used under those situation.

 

[Doc True]

if you got the bike at C&C, I know the guy who traded it in (he traded it in for a new C50T-he likes cruisers more and it goes with his 2015 Honda Goldwing). I tried to trade him out of that Sergent seat before he traded the bike, but I was a week late (I was on vacation when he traded)..

We're talking about the same bike. If it makes you feel better, that seat went to a good home. I plan on putting alot of happy miles on it.

 

[DCTFAN]

...
I'm not sure what happems if you were to put the ignition off rather than hitting the kill switch. My guess is that it would still change down gracefully.
I have only seen the one report of a DCT bike stalling.
Mike

If you turn the ignition off while moving, the gears cannot change because there is no power to the gear shift motor.
The engine stays in gear clutch disengaged and will coast happily until gravity or the brakes stop it.
Turning ignition key back on while moving does not revive the engine either. Start button does not work; you have to stop the bike
and start from the beginning.
Behavior is different with the kill switch, the power to the gear shift motor will change down the gears as you slow down.
You can also flip the switch back to resume fuel delivery and ride on.
But if you give throttle a little twist after the kill switch stops the fuel, you cannot revive the engine.

..

 

[mike5100]

If you turn the ignition off while moving, the gears cannot change because there is no power to the gear shift motor.
The engine stays in gear clutch disengaged and will coast happily until gravity or the brakes stop it.
Turning ignition key back on while moving does not revive the engine either. Start button does not work; you have to stop the bike
and start from the beginning.
Behavior is different with the kill switch, the power to the gear shift motor will change down the gears as you slow down.
You can also flip the switch back to resume fuel delivery and ride on.
But if you give throttle a little twist after the kill switch stops the fuel, you cannot revive the engine.

..

Wow - that's great info - and logical too
Mike